Christianity Today Speaks Out

The full article with an excerpt below.

"As fellow Christians, we should have reminded the Gosselins that life is a gift to be received in gratitude, not something to be grasped, purchased, or sold. In many ways, the last four seasons of Jon & Kate Plus Eight is the story of a family that seemed to progressively lose sight of this truth. Of course, they had help along the way from TLC, from the show's producers, and not least of all, from their Christian viewers.When the first few episodes revealed the earning potential of this "everyday family," Jon & Kate Plus Eight became a brand name that was packaged and sold. And many Christians were happy to comply by opening up their wallets and their fellowship halls. When the network and the couple were not satisfied with the money generated through high ratings and book sales, the Gosselin home was filled with product placements and the children were filmed for long hours each week. All the while many (though not all) evangelicals watched with undiscerning eyes. Somewhere along the line we, like Jon and Kate, seemed to forget the warnings of 1 Timothy 6:9-10:But those who want to be rich fall into temptation and are trapped by many senseless and harmful desires that plunge people into ruin and destruction. For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, and in their eagerness to be rich some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pains. (NRSV)It was not until the recent allegations of sexual impropriety arose that a significant number of Christians began to question whether Jon and Kate were indeed the examples of faithful living that we had imagined. Somehow most of us missed the long trajectory that was, day by day, moving them farther from a life of Christian virtue. Sexual immorality—whether actual or merely suspected—caught our attention, but the materialism, narcissism, and exploitation of children that preceded it was largely overlooked."

92 comments:

Rachel said...

Can I get an amen?!

Annies said...

Great article. It would be even better yet if the Assemblies of God would make a statement about Kons lifestyle in light of church doctrine. Did they really ask them to leave their demonination? Maybe they can't if you are not a confirmed member as the Gosselin two are not.

mommytu3 said...

So true. This article made me recall a moment in an episode that showed J&K going to church (it was early in the series, I think) where Kate made the comment about the church. It went something like "They're (the church) nice..they leave us alone." In hindsight, it did strike me odd at the time, but not enough to think long enough about it. Beyond the obvious reason of going to church to worship God, most people I know also enjoy the by-product of growing a deeper faith through bible studies and fellowship with other believers. Kind of odd to want your fellow congregation members to "leave you alone." Has anyone from their home church addressed the current issues surrounding the allegations of adultery and well-documented exploitation of the 8 children?

Mindy said...

AMEN!

Crock said...

AMEN!!!

I truly believe the Church - especially Kon's congretation, should've staged an intervention long ago.

It is completely biblical to loving step-in and try to correct a situation like this. Especially if those kids were ever dedicated in that church.

I recently contacted AFA, an American Family Association- who boycotts just about all things "unholy" and asked them when they were going to approach this issue.

With Christiany Today addressing it, there's no way the Gosslins can hide.

Carolyn said...

I'm born and bread Assembly of God and I would like to say that J&K are NOT a representation of what Assembly of God is about, what we believe, how we act.

I'm just sick that after them being so "Christian" for years and I never knew that until this article.

Now that I know I want nothing more than to turn that woman over my knee and give her a good sound spanking until my hand gets tired.

Run my affiliation through the mud... no way.

I would also like to say that this weekend I went to get a haircut at a new salon that took walk ins. The gal doing my hair had a short cut similar but not identical to Kate's. She asked me how I wanted my hair and kept saying "oh you'd look great a Kate Gosselin cut". After the third time and scissors in her hand I did an "excuse me but I am not comfortable with how you are pushing that style on me and I'm a bit afraid I'm going to end up with something I don't want." Her reply "just try it, it's summer and if you don't like it your hair will always grow back. My reply was to reach up and pull off the cover from my torso, reach down and grab my purse and walk out. She had the guts to follow me out and tell me I had to pay for the shampoo she gave me. I called the owner back and said "I'll come pay YOU when she's not there." The owner apologized, and asked if I wanted another stylist and I told her for all the money in the world I won't return because trust was broken with that shop. She said she understood and that I didn't need to pay for the shampoo.

This show just needs to end. I for one have gone as far as contacting the advertisers for commercials (friends who watch wrote down the advertisers for me) and I've let them know if they continue to advertise during their show I won't purchase.

4girlsoneboy said...

I just forwarded this article to Zondervan publishing house. By the way, the cookbook is still described as being from our favorite close-knit family. Someone better update that item. I hope the Methodist church in Roswell subsribes to Christianity Today.

vaikealukuinen said...

Amen, I'm glad to see a Christian publication finally call J&K out on the way they live. They pay the smallest amount of lip service they can to their Christianity, while living day by day in a way that disrespects each other, their children, and the commandments of their God. It seems to me from all I've seen and read that the only time they set foot in a church or seek out fellowship is with their hands out.

Reading news said...

I think I already posted about the friend of mine who came face to face with Kate in the ladies room at church. Kate quickly lowered her eyes so she would not have to make any eye contact with the woman who was about to say hello to her. I have always sought fellowship in our church so I thought this very strange

Jo Ann said...

Well written article. It's about time someone from the Christian side of things came out and called them on it.

Reading News, I remember reading that about your friend meeting Kate in the restroom where Kate quickly lowered her eyes to avoid eye contact or any interaction. While I'm not trying to defend Kate here, but not making eye contact is a way to avoid interaction with others - and I have to wonder if she has done this to avoid the negative confrontations she must have faced in the past (and currently).

I can be like this as well when I'm not having a great day (hard to do when you're in constant pain from a bad back). I just don't want to deal with people, but still need to go through my day. I'll be polite, but please don't interact with me - how do I do this? Avoiding eye contact.

I can almost understand where she's coming from.

Barbara said...

Kate has become increasingly arrogant as the show progesses. I am not at all surprised that she would lower her eyes so as not to speak to someone she considers beneath her. She is completely cold inside.

Missy said...

Way to go Carolyn! I am proud of the way you stood up against the spread of the Kate Gosselin haircut!!

Jana said...

That was a very thoughtful article, written without taking sides, but really giving consideration to what it means to live a Christian life. I did appreciate that the writer pointed out that while many have been quick to praise the Gosselins for not selectively reducing any embryo, those same people choose not to look too closely at how they became pregnant with so many in the first place.

Maybe this will cause some soul searching for those that have been refusing to see any problem whatsoever in the filming of children's lives for consumer consumption.

Maelstrom said...

Right on! This is how Christianity should be: critical, caring, and clear-eyed. Stick this to Babymama!

Corinne said...

I like to call them Convenience Christians - they're only Christian when it's convenient.

Anonymous said...

GREAT Article.
I'm going over to their site so
I can praise them for their comment.

chesterctymom said...

Great article. It's important to remember that each church sold tickets for Kon's appearance and made a profit. In my opinion, they are as guilty of exploiting the Gosselin children for cash as all of the other sponsors. Those poor kids have made alot of money for many, many adults

Naj said...

It's a great article and it points out what is obvious to many--- that the religion was ruse.

BTW, I have to admit I'd be one of those who'd be very very happy in a church where no one noticed me and left me alone. Not all of us are a social as others.

HW said...

Great article.
We must not forget that Kate also diminished her own "Christian" beliefs by demeaning her husband and insulting him so frequently on tv. Not only did she treat her spouse with disrespect but she did so numerous times in front of her children. No child needs to hear their parent speak badly of the other parent.
This, in my opinion, is breaking of the wedding vows, just as infidelity is.

Lost in Translation said...

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2009/juneweb-only/122-11.0.html
Christianity Today

PLEASE go there and praise them for their work. Many, Many, are negative reviews.
thanks!

Elizabeth said...

Thank goodness, thank goodness, thank goodness!

Hopefully this will reach many of the faithful followers and help them see the light.

Thank you so much for posting this. It is so very important!

Gatha said...

Jo Ann said...
Well written article. It's about time someone from the Christian side of things came out and called them on it.

Reading News, I remember reading that about your friend meeting Kate in the restroom where Kate quickly lowered her eyes to avoid eye contact or any interaction. While I'm not trying to defend Kate here, but not making eye contact is a way to avoid interaction with others - and I have to wonder if she has done this to avoid the negative confrontations she must have faced in the past (and currently).

I can be like this as well when I'm not having a great day (hard to do when you're in constant pain from a bad back). I just don't want to deal with people, but still need to go through my day. I'll be polite, but please don't interact with me - how do I do this? Avoiding eye contact.

I can almost understand where she's coming from.

.....................

This was probably before she finally saw the light that she LOVES her fans! She always felt they were intruding until she realized she would be no one without them.

Yes, she used to even turn her back on people who approached her when she didn't want them to intrude in her life.

And of course, I probably have done that too, but I can't remember when or why.

Sidney said...

Lost in Translation said...
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2009/juneweb-only/122-11.0.html
Christianity Today

PLEASE go there and praise them for their work. Many, Many, are negative reviews.
thanks!
.......................

Yes, I will thank them and I will also forward it to some very important sites. I hope some of the groups that have sponsored Kate will have the opportunity to read this also.

Could this actually mean the Queen of Mean might be stopped? Until seeing this, I had not truly believed anything would stop Kate or TLC.

I now have a glimmer of hope.

Amen! said...

You can call yourself a Christian, you can attend church faithfully, you can put verses on sticky notes all over your house, but you are known by the fruit you bear. And Jon and Kate bear some rotten fruit. Get your show off the air and get your house in order!

Lyndsay said...

wow! normally I wouldn't agree with, or read, a publication like this, but I have to say, they hit the nail on the head with it, and I applaud them for it.

Jana said...

Naj said...

BTW, I have to admit I'd be one of those who'd be very very happy in a church where no one noticed me and left me alone. Not all of us are a social as others.
-----------------------------------

Back when I was still trying to find a church that I "fit" with, I was somewhat the same. I went to hear a reading from scriptures, to hear the sermon and hopefully some good singing/music. But I do tend to always walk with a pleasant look on my face, ready to offer a smile in passing.

There is a lady in my office building who I think is very introverted. She also will not make eye contact if you pass her in the hall or see her in the restroom. But I respect that - and so I don't make eye contact with her anymore either. With Kate, I get more of a feeling that she probably couldn't meet their eyes, as somewhere inside she knows she is a fake.

UncleKid said...

Oh, snap.

What WILL the sheeple think???!??

This smackdown should cause some concern at TLC.

When a leading Christian media source comes out and says, and very directly, I must say, that Kate and Jon are less than credible... well, that's got to start someone worrying about the potential drain on viewership.

And a drain on viewership is just about the only thing that they actually consider reason enough to pull the plug on this atrocity.

Thanks, mods, for sharing this.

overwithKON said...

Amen!

Laura said...

This article has an interesting angle that I did not expect.

As Christians we shouldn't be so "taken" by Jon and Kate. I'm glad someone from the Christian community has spoken up; although I wish they would have admonished Kon.

I sense this is the beginning of the end for Jon and Kate.

REEEAAALLLYYY??? said...

AMEN!!!!!

Incredible article, well-written and defends the faith. As someone else earlier said, I love how they pointed out not only the choice to not reduce the pregnancy, but the potential to use/misuse infertility treatments. Proud of Evangelical Christians for finally standing up. Going over there to post some positive comments.

Expositor said...

Dear Mods,




Thanks so much for opening up this line of discussion.

I know that not everyone views this situation in the context of J & K's professed faith, but many of us do. And I appreciate so much your hard work and forebearence of the many different viewpoints that must come across your desks.




I suspect that chief among Kate's last remaining few supporters are believers. I say that as a former fan of J & K, and a believer in Jesus Christ, and not as a slur against the “sheeple.” For I was once one of those. I address them below.





Dear Fellow Christian,



I think a part of the Christ faith, for many of us is loyalty, but the loyalty to Kate is misplaced.

Kind Christian friend, if you are reading this, please remember how very dear Christ holds these little ones.




These children should be cherished and protected. They should not be treated like animals at the zoo, and their lives, for good or bad, on exhibit for anyone to view and consume in pursuit of prurient interest and entertainment.




They should not be turned into their parent’s meal tickets.





Matthew 18:10
Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven.





Mark 9:42
And whosoever shall offend one of [these] little ones that believe in me,
it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.

Joanna said...

I actually just had TLC the show on, out of a little interest (didn't watch the season premire), but turned it off a few minutes in (too much drama). I've never watched the show religiously, every now and then, mostly in a moment and nothing else on TV interest me (which is usual), or once in a blue when it was an episode I was interested in (like the Puppies eppy, I really loved the orinigal specials and have read Mutiple Blessings, which I actually enjoyed reading, before the media took over their lives).

I've hardly ever read anything in Gosselins Without Pity (wasn't sure why I came here in the first place from the Duggars site, which I regularly read and occuationaly at). I won't address any of the actual issues directly, but I have to say this article caught my eye is so spot on. I have seenthe worst of marriages survive to even more joyful days then before, while some marriages with even lesser issues or far less diffcult issues ended divorce. Can Jon and Kate's marriage survive, can they find their love for each other again, can joyful days return, appsoultly. Are they trying, are they willing to do whatever it takes, including closing the door on the show for good (seems like Jon couldn't care less anymore), are they putting God in the center of everything (dosen't seem like it), I don't know. One think I do notice, or it sure does seem this way, is that they each put their children over the spouse, which is a mistake most couples make. Many couples once they become parents put their children first and do everything for their children, but not for the spouse anymore (which leads to a lot of marriages breaking up.)

One thing I do know for sure about the articles being written, true or not, is that the people who write those articles make a ton of money for writing them, and the people who take scandoules photos of the family get paid millions. Press and popperutizzi is often about the almighty dollar, rather then honest news reporting. (same with Nayda Suleman and anyone else). I don't know what's really going on behind the scenes with the Gosselins, I don't know if sources, friends, or family members are telling the truth or attempting to case in. I am praying for the Gosselins, who certaintly need less time in front of the camera. I'm not against families or ordinary people doing reality shows in general, but there is a right way and wrong way to do them. And I do believe that family "reality shows" should be "real", not staged in any way. If ratings fall because it's nothing but geniune documentry just trying to get their message out and trying to inspire other people and ratings drop because of that, then so be it. I also think they shouldn't film "ALL YEAR Around", or at least only a few days a month, rather then several days every week. Seasons should be seasons, like 10 or 13 episodes in the fall, take a few months off, then maybe another 10 or 13 episodes in the spring. 40 NEW EPISODES for ONE season! Now that's going WAY overboard.

goawayJandK said...

Just to make a clarification:

This article ( excellent by the way ) is not necessarily representative of CT as a whole publication. If you look at the bottom of the article there is a disclaimer.

That said, this is GREAT exposure for KON . I think our little friend Pastor Craig Y needs to see this.......

Punkinbugg said...

I'm sorry but their antics were NOT overlooked by this children's ministry Bible teacher, and it happened early on...

The first time they zoomed in on that bottle of Juicy Juice, an alarm went off in my head.

Cupcake-gate sealed the deal.

That she supposedly gave permission for him to "date" was completely around the bend.

This couple is LOST.

kelly_luvs_it said...

UncleKid said "What WILL the sheeple think???!??"
****************************
Just for laughs I posted it over on "another" website - I mentioned it wasn't from a "gossip rag like Star magazine".... it was post #2 - and it's been deleted....

I guess "someone" considers it a "Christian gossip rag"....

ImFrancie said...

Awesome article, simply awesome.

Most heartening is that this thoughtful analysis is coming from an evangelical Christian perspective and addressed to evangelical Christians, a core demographic of the fan base as TLC well knows.

Whether one believes that the Gosselins' faith in Christ is sincere or not (I truly hope it is sincere), it is still a huge shame that it became part of TLC's packaging of this family.

Lisa said...

I just left a comment of support on the article.

As a committed Christian, I am so frustrated with fellow Christians who are so unwilling to see what is RIGHT IN FRONT OF THEM. Please know that we are not all like that.

TandLMommy28 said...

Amen and Amen!

I am shocked that the Gosselins were not asked to live the A of G a long time ago, to be honest. They are VERY strict. I attended a A of G youth group in high school because my Baptist church didn't have one. My mom started going to church there but when she did not speak in tongues, she was asked to leave. And Jon and Kate did much worse than not speak in tongues... of course if they were tithing the church may have been hesitant to kick them to the curb. Churches kick people's memberships all the time. They never say you can't attend but they do take away memberships if they believe a person is giving the church a bad name. once upon a time my pastor's son's girlfriend got pregnant and he lost his membership. After he got his life straight (he was in a lot of mess, not just the girlfriend), he had to re-take membership classes and re-join. That's just normal church stuff as far as I've always known.

Angie said...

That was a great article. It almost makes me want to forgive that magazine for interview Joe the Plumber.

Dianna said...

AMEN! AMEN!

Finally someone in the Christian community speaking up! Let's hope others follow their lead!

Concerned Mom said...

Amen! Finally! If she still has any church visits planned, she better be prepared for all the cancellations coming her way......

marsneeze said...

This article by far is the best I have seen written yet. If only they would read it and let it speak to their hearts....

Again, I feel so sad for the kids. I just wish there were something we could really do to help them escape the pain of their lives. Divorce really, really, sucks for kids especially.

Pamela Jaye said...

Thank God.
(and that's just from reading the excerpt)

thanks for sharing. I'm going to link to the orig on my facebook page. If it's still out there.

Kathryn said...

What amazes me is that many seemed to be unaware of how TLC seemed to carefully craft and perpetuate the image of the Gosselins as Christians when it was obvious that they'd lost their way long ago. It hasn't been long ago that a collection plate was passed for donations after the Gosselins spoke at churches when there didn't appear to be a financial need to do so. Even the Christian T-Shirts could have been product placement. I saw them on sale at WalMart for $ 6.95 each not long after the The Gosselins wore them om TV. In my opinion, TLC went after the Christian audience because they knew that even if they saw the Gosselins for what they've become, Jesus offers forgiveness to those who seek it. If Jesus can forgive the Gosselins, then others can, too. To me, it seems like Christians were taken advantage in the worst possible way since they are a large part of the Gosselin's fan base.

Carrin said...

I really can't imagine Jon would put himself back in that very bad marriage.

I think he looks so far gone that is the last thing he would hope for.

His face on that season premier tells it all.

nanasez said...

This, in my opinion, is breaking of the wedding vows, just as infidelity is.
*******************
I agree. It's a failure to honor, a failure to respect, and a failure to truly love. Love is more than a feeling. It's action. And a vow to love means to act in love even when the feeling isn't there at the moment.

michelle** said...

AMEN!

Hoping4aMiracle said...

Here is another article that is similar to the Christianity Today article. Makes many good points....

Jon and Kate Plus Alot of Bitterness

I admit that for a while I was hooked on certain reality TV shows, but I’ve pulled the plug on several as of late, keeping my viewing list a lot shorter. (However, I’ve kept Deadliest Catch on the list because I can’t get enough of men battling the Bering Sea — it’s quite thrilling!) Reality TV has destroyed its share of relationships, so I have been hesitant to spend time becoming emotionally involved with the real-life people who inhabit it.

Sadly, its most recent casualty seems to be Jon and Kate Gosselin. The once-happy couple that has endured the challenges of multiple births have now turned on one another, and Monday night’s episode, the fifth-season premiere, revealed the pain that pride, anger, blame-shifting, and resentment bring to a marriage.

Watching as a counselor, I was squirming in my seat. The problems they were describing (in separate interviews) were actually quite common and normal in most marriages. I’ve heard many people express their anger and sadness about feeling underappreciated, having to put dreams on hold, and enduring their spouse saying and doing hurtful things. The biggest test will be how the Gosselins, who are professing Christians, choose to deal with these universal marital issues. If Monday’s episode was any evidence of how they are proceeding, things do not look good.

Most disturbing was the eerie silence in the midst of their anger-filled monologues: there was no counselor to intervene. Self-justifying, self-righteous, bitter statements were left hanging in the air unchallenged and unquestioned, with no outside perspective. Unless they have an intervening wisdom, they are headed for destruction.

God’s perspective on life, relationships, and marriage is not intuitive. In fact, it runs counter to our sinful nature, which is our default operating mode. When we manage our relationships on human reasoning, we inevitably end up “biting and devouring each other,” and destroying each other (Gal. 5:15). Let’s be honest: Women, in Kate’s situation, how many of us would have chosen a submissive spirit as our primary mode of relating to our husband? Men, in Jon’s shoes, would you be waking up daily wondering how you can love your wife as much as you love your own flesh? Probably not. Nor would we desire to display kindness, compassion, and forgiveness, getting rid of all bitterness, rage, and anger. Our fleshly thinking is actually stubborn, selfish, unkind, merciless, and vengeful. With no one to tell us otherwise, we are headed down a path of destruction in our relationships.

So what’s the answer to these very familiar marital disputes? The intervening grace of God’s Word and his redemptive work in our lives. Usually this is only found within the contexts of relationships with other believers who have access to our hearts to help us see where God’s truth intersects with our daily lives. I’m only guessing here, but it seems that Jon and Kate’s marriage is a reflection of where each is spiritually. Could it be that the pressures and stresses of fame and attention have pulled them away from their greatest love: Christ? Perhaps they have dropped church out of their busy schedules, and with that, a group of other Christians who knows them, is aware of their struggles, and helps to keep them accountable? Or has confessing to the TV camera replaced the biblical wisdom of “confess[ing] your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed” (James 5:16)?

Can Jon and Kate Gosselin’s marriage be saved? Absolutely. But not on human terms, not with human wisdom, not with a camera man playing counselor. Only Christ can change our hearts so radically that we are able to die to our wants, our needs, our desires, and live for something greater than ourselves.

http://blog.christianitytoday.com/
women/2009/05/jon_and_kate_plus
_a_lot_of_bit.html

Fay said...

I would like to call them C and E Chrstians, thats Christmas and Easter.

Concerned for the Children said...

I'm sad this author had to say this:
"sexual immorality—whether actual or merely suspected—caught our attention, but the materialism, narcissism, and exploitation of children that preceded it was largely overlooked."

This is simply untrue.
I thank the creators of this site, for you have provided unsuspecting viewers and former fans, such as myself, a place to go and find good, solid information.

What has drawn most of us here, I venture to guess, is an instinct from watching the show and realizing that something just wasn't quite right and was growing progressively worse with each episode.

I, myself, had a bad feeling long ago and simply ventured out into the good 'ol WWW to see what I could see.

Well, that led me to all sorts of information on the web and this is one of them.

I "get" what the author is trying to say - but to say all the horrors we now know were "overlooked" is ignoring the fact that TLC and TLC alone perpetrated this fraud with help from Figure 8, Media in Motion, countless PR people, corporate sponsors and BOTH Jon and Kate themselves.

They worked tirelessly and quite calculatingly to pull the wool over our eyes.
But their sheer greed and upping the ante to stratospheric lavish proportions (trip to hawaii) while Kate was making The Apprentice's Omarosa look like Mary Poppins and demonstrating that she really is the most wretched, ungrateful, shrew of a woman and yes MOTHER -- in the history of television -- bar none -- is what led to the beginning of their undoing.

I'm almost thankful for their unadulterated greed or I may never have realized how badly abused and worked those children are.

I'm almost grateful Kate is the shrillest, most selfish, evil woman to grace the small screen - or I wouldn't have realized that I was witness to the worst kind of Child Exploitation right before my very eyes.

The Bible states that Jesus will shed light on the darkest corners of the earth.

Well, Kate's eyes must be hurting from the blinding light the Lord is shining on her and exposing her self-indulgence of epic proportions....for she surely is one of the darkest women i have ever come across - on television or in real life.

I shudder to think of what the real truth is behind all this, going back as far as her diabolical planning and plot to have those children and make them pay....pay for her lavish lifestyle.

One only need hear her comment on how her child, Mady, was "Awful and Horrible" on a recent trip to Calif. to know what a wretched excuse for a mother this woman is.

Her sheer insensitivity in callously making this statement borders on sociopathic.


To not think that your child will one day realize that thousands of perfect strangers have all sorts of pictures of you inside their home, dvd's of your most precious and intimate childhood memories ("daddy, please don't go"), and are writing countless articles and blogs about you -- and call that good parenting -- is absurd and most definitely, without question child abuse.


I do appreciate the author writing from a compassionate and Christian perspective and while my anger at these people is disguising my own Christian nature, she needs to know those of us who care about those children did NOT overlook anything.
We were LIED to by the Gosselins, the Network and their production company.
They all continue to lie, to the Dept of Labor and their audience, but everything they're putting out there is on tape and is very easily contradicted by something else they say or have said.

It's hard to overlook something when you don't know it's a lie.
I thank the Lord for shining his light on the lie so NOTHING is overlooked from here on in.
Thank you and keep prayers up for the children.

To UnLove, Dishonor and Make Money said...

Does anyone know when the Gosselins actually went on that trip to Hawaii.

I'd really like to know the EXACT month they went.

I think that is one of the key things in all of this.
I know, for me, that's when the little alarm bells that were ringing went into full-on fog horn status.

Anyone?
thanks!

gorenknows said...

"live for something greater than ourselves."

It's now fairly obvious that 'something greater than ourselves' is ourselves in this case, and that includes TLC.

This train wreck is headed for the cliff and the kids can't get off because "ourselves" are too involved with themselves.

SwingsandRoundabouts said...

HW: great comments re. breaking of the marriage vows.

Infidelity is not the only way to devalue the vows one makes. Love, honour, cherish, for better or for worse, til death do us part...only some of the words we use to make a committment. Jon and especially Kate have lost sight of the COMMITTMENT they have made to each other and subsequently to their children. Shame on them.

Normally I would not read a Christian publication, but this article is so well-written and thoughtful and accurate. Bravo to the author, and to those responsible for its inclusion in their publication.

tallblonde said...

To UnLove, Dishonor and Make Money said...
"Does anyone know when the Gosselins actually went on that trip to Hawaii.

I'd really like to know the EXACT month they went."
****************************

Here's a website that scanned Entertainment Insider - the article states they renewed their vows on Maui on August 12th.

http://growingyourbaby.com/2008/09/03/more-jon-and-kate-in-hawaii/

Hope this helps!

Lisa said...

Concerned For The Children, your comment is great and I can feel your concern for the children in your words.

Let me preface this by saying: I am a committed Christian, as I mentioned earlier.

I think when the author mentioned people only being jarred when issues of sexuality came up, she was talking to the

It is sad and frustrating that sometimes Christians can be undone by a claim of Christianity - some Christians hear the word "Christian" and tend to support whoever said it 100% instead of REALLY searching for evidence that the supposed "Christian's" life is bearing the fruit of a relationship with God.

In my opinion, the Church tends to be unhealthily fixated on issues of sex and money. I think it's absolutely true that for many evangelical Christian J&K devotees, it took a sex scandal to shake them out of their "sheeple" sleep and make them see the bigger picture - that something is very wrong here.

Should it have taken that? Not at all; those "parents" have been exploiting those poor babies for years. But I think the author is asserting this: to get Jon and Kate followers to SEE it required something like a sex scandal. Because as we all know, in the eyes of the Church, sex scandals are the supposed dirtiest nastiest Satan-est things that could have happened ever. Much worse than prolonged child exploitation. (I say that sarcastically.)

Anywho. That was my take on the author's take, for what it's worth.

Lisa said...

haha. forgot to finish my thought:

"I think when the author mentioned people only being jarred when issues of sexuality came up, she was speaking to the fact that what often shakes up evangelical Christians the most are issues related to sex."

Sorry 'bout that. :-)

MJC said...

I didn't have time to read through all the posts, forgive me if I'm repeating-- but has anyone else looked at the links at the bottom of the full Christianity Today article on the Christianity Today site? There is a link to a Today's Christian Woman interview with Kate......very enlightening. Particularly the part about her spa days out-- and how much she wants to get back to the kids-- and yet now she's gone all the time.

Emily said...

Long time reader here at GWOP and this is my first post. Love the site, especially the recaps- please keep 'em coming!

I really like this article. I'm no longer a Christian, but I went to Catholic school all my life and I remember some Gospel that said something to the effect of, "If God takes care to provide for the birds in the sky, surely you don't have to worry because he will take even better care of you."

I hope that if J&K still are practicing Christians, they remember that God will provide for them- and he probably doesn't need a reality show to do that.

HappyMommy&Wife said...

FINALLY!!!! Someone in the Christian community speaking truth about the situation! Thank you for a very informative and credible commentary. It has been so frustrating for the few Christians who don't watch the show, who write letters of concern to Zondervan, TLC, sponsors, and local churches churches hosting this couple only to be dismissed as a "hater". It's expected that mainstream media would get on the ratings bandwagon of the Go$$lins. However it has been incredibly discouraging to witness Christians upholding this couple via ratings season after season despite the obvious exploitation, greed and crumbling marriage. I guess this speaks volumes about the modern Christian's view of sin. Sin, when it appears in the form of greed, disrespect for one's spouse, or exploitation of children is acceptable it seems. However unfaithulness seems to be the tipping point. If Jon treated Kate the way Kate has treated Jon & kids all this time, the show would have been canceled 1st season.I think there is a big difference between judging someone and speaking truth about a very controversial situation. Yes, marriages fail, spouses are unfaithful, and poor parenting choices are made in Christian homes. That is not judgement, that is plain truth. We should absolutely pray for the restoration of the marriage and the well-being of the children. Christians are not perfect. However when these issues are filmed with the sole purpose of increasing ratings and financial gain of the couple with no regard to the safety, psychological well being and self-esteem of the children and a Christian shows integrity and character to call them out, why are they judgemental? I applaud the author for being one of the first Christians in a leading news media for speaking truth.

Lassy said...

"Concerned for the Children" - you have hit the nail right on the head.These children will feel the effects of having millions of people witness and/or own copies of their childhood moments as they grow older and more aware. They have been robbed of their privacy and innocence and that is what bothers me the most. Every friend they make, person they date, and all the children that they will have, will know things about them that the world just shouldn't know. They won't feel that they have very much control over their own lives. They can't be the gatekeeper of their own past.
Very little of their childhoods are going to remain sacred and private. I first began to despise the show during the potty training episode when Kate: A)allowed it to be filmed and B)made a point to take a picture of all the kids with the first "poop" that they made in their potties. How in the world can a mother embarrass their child like that? That wasn't funny or cute, it was degrading. Nothing short of public humiliation. Sure, they were too young to realize what was going on at the time, but that doesn't make it ok. Ten years from now, they will see it a lot differently. They will have to suffer that embarrassment for the rest of their lives. They will resent what their parents have done. Kate insists she is doing all this for the kids. She's going to have a rude awakening when the kids leave home and never come back.........and all she'll be left with are tanned arms, whitened teeth, and pictures of her kids with their poops.

Lynette said...

Wonderful article.

Katie said...

I'm pretty sure that they went to Hawaii for the faux renewal in August of 2008. I think I remember seeing pap pics in a magazine. It seemed very strange that they would do it nine years in and not on an actual anniversary like their tenth that is coming up this month. They really must think the viewers are quite dumb.

A Mother's Walk said...

Corinne said...
I like to call them Convenience Christians - they're only Christian when it's convenient.

--------------

I agree. They only rely on God when it is in their best interest. It is very sad. I like the way you put it: "Convenience Christians" never heard it that way, but will use that from now on!!

PhillyHockey Mom said...

Crock said...
AMEN!!!

I truly believe the Church - especially Kon's congretation, should've staged an intervention long ago


I think that when her parents did this over the donations/house renavations when the tups were born and that is when she cut them off. I find it hard to believe that her family doesn't want anything to do with being grandparents just out of the blue. Didn't they just about raise the twins when she was on her how ever many weeks of bed rest she was on? (The # seems to keep changing) I think they see right through Kate and have her number and she doesn't like it. She can't fool the and I bet they call her out on her half truths or embelishments. I am happy to see that churches are starting to take notice and although I don't think any of them have the guts to ask for $$$ back, the word must be getting around and the bookings have had to have stopped. I would like to know if the report of them being asked to step away fromt heir church is true, because at my church you are spoken to and the behavior has to be very bad for them to step in. The church board really has to have some bad things on you and not just hear say in the community or on the tabloids. Anyway, I am digging the article and hoping through all the pressue from so many outlets, that the cameras are stopped and the kids can relax and be kids, well as much as Kate will let them!

Ms.Peach said...

No more love offerings. We tried to tell them. Jon and Kate are fake Christians. They pushed all the buttons that the churches wanted to hear. When your own church kicks you out, that's pretty bad. The well-meaning folks that paid money to listen to these two were scammed! It's time for the churches to call for the children to stop being exploited by these greedy, lying parents. I said it before, Kate is the daughter of a preacher and she knew EXACTLY what she was doing.

AppysRTheBest said...

On a little diffent note...I'm signed up for a Bible Verse of the day. This is what I got this morning:

"Whoever loves money never has money enough; whoever loves wealth is never satisfied with his income. This too is meaningless. Ecclesiastes 5:10"Hmmmmm......how appropriate.

Sue said...

IMO, Kate realized the gig was up with church speaking engagements a few months ago. Thus, the foray into cookbooks, recipes, children's clothing and perfume.
She doesn't need the church anymore.

Concerned for the Children said...

Yes, Lisa! Exactly!
Thank you for your take on that part of the article.

I think some people are also unhealthily fixated on those children, and that is the most troublesome part of it all.

I just don't get it!

(they are definitely very adorable and cute, but so are all children!)

I absolutely ADORE children, but it would never occur to me to pay money for a book of someone else's children.
What do they do with it when they get it home?
Weird!

I really, really just don't get it!
Are THAT many people in this country THAT obsessed with little children?

I just don't understand why they can't see that these are real live HUMAN BEINGS (not characters in a cartoon) and how absurdly creepy and disturbing it will be to them when they realize total strangers bought pictures of them and took them home to stare at the goodness knows what else!!

Who Did What First said...

Katie said...
"I'm pretty sure that they went to Hawaii for the faux renewal in August of 2008. I think I remember seeing pap pics in a magazine. It seemed very strange that they would do it nine years in and not on an actual anniversary like their tenth that is coming up this month. They really must think the viewers are quite dumb."


Actually, Katie, I think TLC already knew they wouldn't make it to their tenth anniversary, when people would normally renew vows.

To UnLove, Dishonor and Make Money said...

It does!!
Thank you tallblonde!! :-)

4girlsoneboy said...

I took my own advice and sent Zondervan publishing a copy of the article in Christianity Today Speaks Out. This is the brief reply received today and obviously no one really cares.

" Response (Carrie Colter) 06/02/2009 11:29 AM
Good morning,

Thank you for contacting Zondervan and for your comments.

Thank you
Carrie
Zondervan Customer Care"

If I get any further correspondence from them I will pass it on.

To UnLove, Dishonor and Make Money said...

okay...now i'm even more steamed at these two.

If they renewed their vows in August and Kate told Jon "it's over six months ago" as was reported when, in April, May?

that makes that whole Hawaiian trip MORE of a sham than even I realized.

And TLC/Figure 8, for it's part, rather than say "you need to work on your relationship for the sake of the children, let's cancel so you can stay home and work with your Pastor or a therapist", they said "we need to keep the gravy train rolling and fool those imbeciles who watch this show and buy from our advertisers"

No More TLC!!!
The gig is up!

To UnLove, Dishonor and Make Money said...

http://growingyourbaby.com/2008/09/03/more-jon-and-kate-in-hawaii/


Ha, Ha. Jon identified as "systems engineer" still.
TLC such LIARS!

Jon just said this month he quit his job TWO YEARS AGO!

These people just keeping digging bigger and bigger holes for themselves with all their messed up lies.

momof5 said...

Interesting article. Seems as if the Christian community is on to them also. Here's another tidbit I found in a previous article...
http://www.christianitytoday.com/tcw/2009/janfeb/1.22.html?start=3

This question & answer:

What difference have you noticed since you guys started doing that?

When I come home I've really missed the kids, and I'm ready to jump back in again to all the noise and commotion. Though I admit it takes me about a half hour to get used to the pace again. The time away just makes me a better mom, period. I think I missed that in the early years.

Lynn Jones said...

Isn't the church supposed to be there for people when they are struggling? Christians can stand by and be there for people without condoning behavior. It disturbs me to read comments saying their membership should be revoked. Jesus didn't hang out with those following the straight and narrow--he reached out to those doing the same type of things the Gosselin parents seem to be doing. It all boils down to love.

Anonymous said...

Does Assembly of God tithe members? I wonder if J&K still attend services following their move? I wonder if they contribute generously?

just wondering said...

Anonymous said...
Does Assembly of God tithe members? I wonder if J&K still attend services following their move? I wonder if they contribute generously?

********************************

I don't know about the church, but a waitress who was just interviewed said that they only tip 8% and that just stinks!

Persuaded said...

This was a wonderful article.. I was so pleased to see it, I made a comment:
"Although we choose to have no television in our home, I have certainly heard of the Gosselin family. A couple of months ago (before all this gossip-y news broke) I finally watched a bit of their show online. I was looking forward to a heartwarming bit of entertainment with some organizational tips thrown in for good measure. I was, however utterly appalled. Mrs. Gosselin treats her husband with blatant disrespect, and treats her children with harshness and seeming indifference... in the episode I watched she raised her voice and reprimanded a very young child for vomiting in his bed. She then laid him alone on the laundry room floor, turned out the light, shut the door and spent the evening baking in the kitchen with another child. I was utterly repulsed by her behavior, and heartbroken for that little boy. Since then it seems like everything has blown up regarding this family and I have to wonder why anyone is surprised. Sadly, they have been in trouble for years."

Of course there were about 250 comments already so I don't know if anyone will actually read it, but it felt good to write it anyway;)

maybepoorbutnocheapskate said...

I don't know about the church, but a waitress who was just interviewed said that they only tip 8% and that just stinks!

Must be because Jon was once a waiter and knows exactly how much of the patrons' bill in sales must be reported to the IRS. It is way to keep servers honest. Shame on the Gosselins.

msrylee said...

Lynn Jones, I think that churches are to serve people during good and difficult times. Some denominations have the right to discipline members and adherents if an obvious offense against their teachings occurs. Both Jon and Kate fall under this need to be disciplined by their church, assuming the church upholds these teachings. Perhaps someone familiar with their doctrine could clarify this for us.

As part of discipline, confession of wrong-doing is necessary, as is the commitment to do absolutely everything in the future not to do wrong again.

I trust that their church will deal with them in a fair but just manner. If Jon and Kate have stopped attending their church, then I'm not sure if any action can be taken.

MEAN KATE said...

Persuaded said...
This was a wonderful article.. I was so pleased to see it, I made a comment:
"Although we choose to have no television in our home, I have certainly heard of the Gosselin family. A couple of months ago (before all this gossip-y news broke) I finally watched a bit of their show online. I was looking forward to a heartwarming bit of entertainment with some organizational tips thrown in for good measure. I was, however utterly appalled. Mrs. Gosselin treats her husband with blatant disrespect, and treats her children with harshness and seeming indifference... in the episode I watched she raised her voice and reprimanded a very young child for vomiting in his bed. She then laid him alone on the laundry room floor, turned out the light, shut the door and spent the evening baking in the kitchen with another child. I was utterly repulsed by her behavior, and heartbroken for that little boy. Since then it seems like everything has blown up regarding this family and I have to wonder why anyone is surprised. Sadly, they have been in trouble for years."

Of course there were about 250 comments already so I don't know if anyone will actually read it, but it felt good to write it anyway;)

6/03/2009 1:55 PM

****
In total agreement.
Kate treats her family horribly. And turning off lights leaving a child alone is one of her "things"...she did that with their potty training...left them on the potty, turning off the lights and closing the door. UGH POOR KIDS!!!!!!!!!! We need to pray she be stopped!!!!!!!!

Naj said...

Lynn Jones said...
Isn't the church supposed to be there for people when they are struggling? Christians can stand by and be there for people without condoning behavior. It disturbs me to read comments saying their membership should be revoked. Jesus didn't hang out with those following the straight and narrow--he reached out to those doing the same type of things the Gosselin parents seem to be doing. It all boils down to love.

++++
If the church is being used as part of a scam by those who have no connection with the church, then it has the right to be concerned. If they reach out to the couple and are ignored or rebuffed, they have no other recourse.
Be as wise as serpents and as innocent as doves. IOW, give them the benefit of the doubt, try to redeem them, but don't let the misrepresent and harm you.
There is a difference between being loving and forgiving and being a doormat.

truthalwayscomesout said...

Jon & Kate. . . Too Late?____A train rolled into my tiny little neighborhood three years ago. About a year later, that train was making some noise as the wheels were starting to come off the tracks. Now, that train - as everyone with eyes and ears knows - has full-scale derailed.
by Walt Mueller

A good article from someone in the Gosselins' old neighborhood.

Sue said...

The article "Jon and Kate....Too Late? by Walt Mueller is the best article I have read about this mess, bar none. It should be read by anyone who cares about the Gosselin children.

Marie France said...

4girlsoneboy said...
I just forwarded this article to Zondervan publishing house. By the way, the cookbook is still described as being from our favorite close-knit family. Someone better update that item. I hope the Methodist church in Roswell subsribes to Christianity Today.
____
Yes, me too! I hope that nasty, snotty, and just plain mean "Pastor" Craig Yoshihara at Roswell Methodist Church reads the article! As a matter of fact, I think I will email it to him now. He's so oblivious (SHEEPLE) that he may pull some lame excuse out of his a$$ as to why the outstanding writer at Christianity Today is not credible. Oh - and he will diss her character, too. I cannot stand him - what a hypocrite!!!!

Sidney said...

There is a wonderful man that lives in the Gosselins former neighborhood who has written a wonderful open letter to the Gosselins.

He has served in a Youth Ministry and talks like a true Christian. His letter is long, but so worthwhile.

Oh, how I wish the Gosselins would read it and heed it.

I wish Zondervan and TLC would read and apply its counsel. Please read it in its entirety. It is excellent.

http://www.learningmylines.blogspot.com/

Dew said...

I'm proud to say there was actually quite a vocal group of practicing Christians, even those who call ourselves evangelicals, myself included, who were speaking out about this family's lack of Christ-like behavior long before the affairs ever took place.

Many Christians want to see the best in people and that's great. But when someone is harming a child, even someone who is a Christian, as Christians it is our duty to protect that child and speak out against what is happening. It's also our duty not to let this family defraud any more Christians by collecting love offerings, and to demand that make amends to all the Christians and others they've defrauded in the past.

oolong_girl said...

I also noticed that during their vow-renewal-in-Hawaii scam that they had no family or friends there. Jon's extened family who attended were all strangers and it was so obvious that everyone was uncomfortable with the staged event.
And as some others have noted, I too wondered why they renewed their vows after 9 years instead of a milestone anniversary year, such as 10,15, 20. It was so fake.

Jon & Kate have no friends. I noticed that from the beginning. Even when "volunteers" or helpers came by in early episodes, there didn't seem to be any real friendship, but rather an employer-employee dynamic. Creepy and sad.

Praying for J&K said...

This is in response to the person who asked how the Assemblies of God Fellowship works as far as membership and discipline. In our AG church (and probably most others), membership is for people who are committed to living for Christ and who genuinely try to stay pure by reading and applying the scriptures to their lives. (Of course, we all struggle with sin and are works in progress, but as we mature in Christ, our desires will change and we will want to be more like Him). As a member, a person has the privilege of voting on important church church matters such as pastoral, deacon and elder selection, building projects, financial matters, etc. It is hoped that the members are praying for God's will in the church and that they will vote based on their knowledge of scripture and what they hear God speaking to them. If a member has had a moral failure or has fallen into some kind of destructive behavior such as a drug addiction, they will undergo counseling from the pastor and be given every chance to repent and turn their life around. However, if they continue down a destructive path, they will be required to give up their membership status as they may not be capable of making wise decisions for the church's future. I've never heard of anyone being asked to leave the church. Even sex offenders are welcomed but are under constant supervision. We believe that love, not rejection, is the way to win souls. There are many people in our church who have not become members. In fact, a person can choose to attend their whole life without becoming a member. I don't know anything about J&K's church situation or membership status, but I would be very sad if I heard they had been asked to actually leave the church. That would be like saying that sinners are not welcome. I'm hoping that someone in their church has tried to counsel them.... I truly believe that they started out with a strong faith. I loved Kate's book, "Multiple Blessings." I left a copy in our break room at work and it disappeared right away. I was so excited that someone my read it and be transformed by all the wonderful scripture references and God stories! However, shortly after that I began to see the problems in the marriage and their other relationships and was actually sorry I put the book out. For an unbeliever it could be just what they need to confirm their belief that Christians are hypocrites. Oh well...God's word never returns void, right? We all need to lift this family in crisis up in prayer. May God soon be back in the center of their lives!

ForeverHopeful said...

I really WANT to believe that Kate will have an AH-HA Moment and begin to see how UN-Christian her behavior has been!

People CAN change! First, though, she must ACKNOWLEDGE her behavior and realize how much her attitude has played in this whole mess.

Ivie said...

Longtime reader, first time poster.

I must say this is one of the best articles I have read in a long while. I have to admit that I was taken in by the show at the very beginning and I thought how cute the kids were (and still are) and how wholesome the family seemed. I loved and admired Kate's strong personality and organization. But little by little, the show started to dis interest me b/c it started being more about where they were being sent off to, then their everyday lives. Plus, I thought how odd it was that the kids always seemed to have awesome clothes (matching, no less) and all kinds of toys, bikes, tables etc. I have a one year old and it's hard for me to shop at trendy kids places (like Gymboree) b/c of how expensive they r, but nonetheless, I never thought much about it. Until recently, with all the drama.
Needless to say, Karma is a Bi***, and from whats been written about Kate's behaviour towards her family, it doesnt surprise me how things are going. Whats so unfortunate about the situation is that fact that there are 8 little lives involved that didnt ask for all this drama and are paying the price of their parents' mistakes.

TUNDRA said...

Holy Cow - the average customer rating for Eight Little Faces is one and one-half stars.

http://www.amazon.com/Eight-Little-Faces-Kate-Gosselin/dp/0310318467