Gosselins and Discipline

There have always been many comments about the Gosselins and how they discipline---or don't discipline---their kids. They have admitted that there are different consequences for bad behavior off-camera that they don't want shown on television. (For the record, I agree with that.) But does that mean that the same consequences for the same bad behavior are used consistently, and certain things are left on the cutting-room floor, or does it mean that different days and different circumstances have diffferent results depending on whether there is a camera present?

I would speculate that they base their method of discipline on whether or not the film crew is there. While this is a good idea for reasons of privacy and dignity---one of the few examples of such with this particular family---I feel that the lack of set, predictable consequences for misbehavior is doing a disservice to the children and contributing to them acting out of control. In fact, I would submit that it's Jon and Kate's overall inconsistency toward discipline that is causing their children, as precious as they are, to behave in ways not fitting for 4 1/2-year-olds and 8-year-olds.

With their lifestyle being what it is, as busy and demanding and chaotic as it can get---especially for small children---it must be adding to the general confusion when expectations and consequences seem to be a random flip of the coin. And the kids all seem like pretty smart cookies; they must be getting to the point where they realize that they can get away with a lot more during certain circumstances: on filming days, in public places, when a helper is in charge, etc.

A few comments were made on the "Leis and Luaus" thread that the Gosselins used to brush off Mady's bad behavior as hunger or dramatics or just her personality, and not really punish for it---but that now, all of a sudden, they are imposing consequences for her "dramatics" by not allowing her to participate in fun vacation activities with the rest of the family. I realize that no parent is perfect, that sometimes it takes awhile to decide to really crack down and enforce standards of behavior, and that it's "better late than never" to require good behavior of your child. But there is still the problem of consistency. Sometimes Mady is punished; other times she is not. Mady is punished for one thing; Cara is not punished for the same thing. One of the sextuplets throws a fit or hits another and it's overlooked; next time it's dealt with. On Monday this behavior will get you put in time out; on Tuesday it's a different punishment, on Wednesday it's simply ignored...all dependent upon the moods of the parents, where they happen to be and what they happen to be doing that particular day, or whether the film crew is there or not.

One thing that child-raising experts have always stressed is consistency of word and deed. The only consistency this family seems to have is that there isn't any. I realize that it's pure speculation for me to say what exactly they do as far as discipline goes and why, but I'm only basing my observations on what has been seen on the show and verbalized by the family in interviews, talks, etc. If Jon and Kate want their kids to grow up to be productive members of society---and to not give them absolute hell during the teen years!---they should start by setting rules, ensuring those rules are followed, and practicing consistent discipline. Even if they change very little else about their lives, unchanging standards of behavior across the board would go a long way toward improving the kids' attitudes and behavior both.

- Contributed by Natasha

176 comments:

Anonymous said...

"Mady is punished for one thing; Cara is not punished for the same thing."

That is because as we all know Cara, along with Hannah are Kate's pets. It's a shame Kate doesn't give the same attention and show the same interests in all of her children, namely Lex, Mady (who is screaming for some attention!!!) and poor Joel.

Coming from a large family I know that parents often treat their children differently without even knowing it. But they need to show love and take an interest in what all of their children do and that is something that Kate is apparently not doing.

Jan said...

The discipline in that home is a joke. My 5 year old has watched it a few times and calls it, "The Bad Kid Show". The times we've watched the show together, I use it as a lesson in "Wow, did you see that? We don't do that in our home, do we?"

Anonymous said...

I loooove John and Kate plus 8 and I never once even thought anything negative about it..the more I read these comments the more things make sense and I do agree with a lot of the posts on here ...I however don't agree with saying the kids are not disciplined ...having 8 small kids has to be very difficult and although they do have a lot of help i feel the kids are well behaved for their age..they are Kids after all...

Anonymous said...

First let me say that I can not stand Kon and do not even wish them well at this point. BUT I have always been amazed at how easily and consistently the kids, when told to go to a corner, do it without fighting, without explaining, and stay there until they are told to get up. So something is going right and something is consistent.

Arieslikekate said...

As my father used to say "spare the rod and spoil the child ".

I got my share of whoopins when I was growing up, and I am not spoiled.

Anonymous said...

Coming from a large family, I know all to well what it is like when a Mother favors one child over another or even another gender over another. My Mother actually told me she wished I had died instead of my infant brother. How sad is that. And she also was a "bible thumper." Please don't tell me that it doesn't leave scars. :( The Gosselin children are going to have major issues before this is all said and done and what is really sad is people out there really think she is the greatest mother of all time. Come on people, wake up...

Laura Linger said...

What makes me so angry about how Mady is treated is that her "parents" helped to create the monster she has become. Isn't that part of the show's schtick, that Mady is the "problem child," the "free spirit" who is mouthy and obstinate? How many times have we had to listen to KON sigh that "Mady was just being Mady"?

When you set such low expectations for anyone, especially a child, that child can and will live up to them. They have reduced a little girl to nothing more than a caricature. A character that she plays. The role wasn't created by her; it was created FOR her. And now they punish her for acting the part?

Anonymous said...

I have actually been impressed with the discipline Jon and Kate have been using on their children. I am a pre-school teacher and I can say from experience that the Gosselin children behave much better than most children their age. They have learned to share and behave well in a group, which is definitely a step above the rest. I would hardly say they're out of control in comparison to the groups of 4-5 year olds I have to deal with. When the kids are sent to timeout, they actually go! And they sit there until they're told they can leave! The discipline is as consistent as it can ever get when raising a family that large. If a child isn't punished for behaving badly it's usually because neither parent is looking, which is perfectly understandable. Maddy does have behavioral issues, but I think Jon and Kate do as good of a job as anyone can do to address them and understand why she behaves the way she does. Remember, no one is perfect. I think it's unfair to criticize this aspect of the show.

Anonymous said...

So something is going right and something is consistent.


Or they are scared of worse consequences later if they don't. I've seen the kids flinch when approached by a scolding adult. Not a good sign.

Anonymous said...

I've seen the kids flinch when approached by a scolding adult.
Interesting. Can you tell us which episodes these occured?

Anonymous said...

As my father used to say "spare the rod and spoil the child ".

I got my share of whoopins when I was growing up, and I am not spoiled.


So you are suggesting that J&K spank their children?

Anonymous said...

First let me say that I can not stand Kon and do not even wish them well at this point. BUT I have always been amazed at how easily and consistently the kids, when told to go to a corner, do it without fighting, without explaining, and stay there until they are told to get up. So something is going right and something is consistent.

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Kate herself has said that she spanks the kids, but it's never shown on tv (thank goodness for that!). I have a feeling that the reason those kids skidaddle to the corner so fast is to avoid a spanking. JMO

Anonymous said...

Coming from a large family, I know all to well what it is like when a Mother favors one child over another or even another gender over another. My Mother actually told me she wished I had died instead of my infant brother. How sad is that.

----------------------

Anon, that brought tears to my eyes. Even at my worst, I don't think I would ever even come close to saying that to my own child. I hope your adult years are bright and full of laughter =)

SmartyQ said...

11/14/2008 1:17 PM Anonymous said... 'So something is going right and something is consistent.'
Or they are scared of worse consequences later if they don't. I've seen the kids flinch when approached by a scolding adult. Not a good sign.
The Gosselins, in one of their 'talks,' said they spanked the children. Both Kon are rough with the children (except for Hannie) and drag them by the arms and shoulders. They see their sister forced to sleep in the basement because she didn't obey the rules. (Don't give me Sassy likes it because she wasn't consulted. Yet, Hannah and Leah climb in their parents' bed in the morning to cuddle.) Kate walks around with an empty paper towel roll, which I suspect she uses to bean the kids. (I tried it, and you catch someone with the end, and it stings.) Kate clearly doesn't like the boys, Mady or Sassy, and they see their mother slap their father (hard) who, at least, is almost as big as she, and who is someone she supposedly likes. I don't know what conclusions the OPs will draw, but I know what I think. :(

natasha said...

No, they are not as bad as many kids their age. In fact, I don't think they're "bad" at all. I just think they're a little bit lacking in guidance. When I spoke of "discipline" I was referring more to a "method of training" than a synonym for "punishment."

I also know, as I pointed out in the original post, that we don't see everything that goes on in their lives.

Anonymous said...

I think someone should get Super Nanny to this house fast. Maybe GWoP could assist with this.

Jen said...

Have Jon and Kate stated publicly that they spank? I believe that I read this somewhere, but I can't remember.

If that's the case, it does prompt me to wonder how they could possibly administer punishments with consistency. The original poster is right -- either there are different punishments for the same misbehaviors depending on whether or not the film crew is there...or punishments are administered immediately if the camera crew's not there, but the child has to wait if the cameras are rolling. Either way, the inconsistency must be totally confusing to the kids.

Moons in Leo said...

Anonymous said...
I have actually been impressed with the discipline Jon and Kate have been using on their children. I am a pre-school teacher and I can say from experience that the Gosselin children behave much better than most children their age. They have learned to share and behave well in a group, which is definitely a step above the rest. I would hardly say they're out of control in comparison to the groups of 4-5 year olds I have to deal with.


Lordy be, if these kids are better behaved than your students, God help you. Where is your class held ~ Leavenworth or Attica?

Anonymous said...

The one where I saw Mady flinch was the one where they went to Thomas the Train. I can't remember the name of the other one.

Anonymous said...

To those who say the tups behave better than their pre-school classes, perhaps it's time to re-evalutate classroom management. I've never had a pre-school class where screaming, hitting, and tantrums were tolerated. Children tend to rise to the standards set for them.

Anonymous said...

I think punishing their kids--or not--is the least of the concerns with regards to the children's behavior. I believe the dysfunction of that household has a far, far, far greater impact on their behavior than anything else.

Rufus said...

These Anon posters who claim these kids are better behaved than others or that they behave well enough because, in fact, they are just kids, are living in some alternate universe.

Any kid who behaves worse than these kids do has a serious problem that needs to be dealt with - just as the Gosselin kids do. And to give me the whole "kids will be kids" crap is a joke. If my kids knew kids like that, I'd be steering my kids far, far away.

Anonymous said...

I work for the Special Education department of the local school district, and during the last school year I had three PPCD classrooms (Preschool Program for Children with Disabilities). I am a staff member who travels between campuses, and I had several students who were non verbal, presentend with severe sensory issues, and had a tendency to run out of the room. However, I only had one student who consistently hit, and the staff always collaborated in an effort to find tools to assist the student to decrease his frustration.

While I agree that some kiddos have a tendency to hit, you see this decrease with time. These kiddos are four and a half - I feel like their parents still see them as "little " and forget what children can learn/respond to at that age (and, as pointed out earlier, they appear capable).

During the San Diego episode, one of the girl tups hit one of her sisters, and their mother just walked away. Hopefully, going to pre-school will help remind Jon and Kate what four years olds can do. You would think they would remember as they have older children, but, as Kate reminds us, they (allegedly) have not slept much in four years.

Anonymous said...

My five year old granddaughter watches the show and will often say that "Mady needs a time out".
Time out is needed, but she also needs some serious attention from her parents or who knows where she will end up.

Anonymous said...

In response to the original blog posted i too agree that better to start now then later on disciplining. I shouldve added that in one of my few posts that at least JOK are starting to do that with Mady..however,i find it troubling that they chose to do it while taking all these trips when it shouldve started at home. They didnt mind her being such a free spirit at that time, but now since they have ventured out of the home it has changed. I am mostly concerned with the fact that JOK do not give their kids they proper affection and attention they deserve..IMO

Anonymous said...

We can disagree about the techniques J&K are using with Mady all day in regards to her behavior/outbursts, etc. but my question/issue the whole thing is why show any of it or bring it up in the first place?

Since they're obviously trying to air fewer of Mady's tantrums on air, then why does Kate find it necessary to explain Mady's absence (or why does TLC write it into her script)? With 7 other kids making cookies I honestly wouldn't have noticed that she was not there; same goes with duck feeding or many other activities. Simply don't show her and don't bring it up, J&K. Only 2 of the girls participated in the hula lessons but no explaination was given for the others' absence, so why not do the same thing with other situations?

IMHO Kate feels mentioning Mady not being in a scene is part of her punishment (kind of like rubbing it in). What loving, caring parent does that to their child? Oops, I forgot - J&K are neither, nor are they mature enough to be making decisions about what about their children should be filmed and commented on and what should be private - another reason for oversight and on-set advocates for the minor children. It's obvious the people at TLC are giving J&K advice about what is best for the show ONLY and they don't really care one iota about the welfare of the kids.

Wow, are they doing a number on the emotional development of these kids and affecting their futures. If it was considered emotional abuse by some professionals I wouldn't be surprised.

alana said...

Inconsistency appears to be the foundation upon which the Gosselin family dynamics are built.

Inconsistency in EVERYTHING:
If mommy's face looks happy today she won't be so grouchy to me and maybe I'll get a rare treat, too.

If mommy's not mad at daddy tonight, then daddy won't pull my hair so hard when he bathes me before bedtime. If daddy's face looks happy and he talks in his soft-daddy voice, it will be safe to ask for a bedtime story tonight.

The mailman didn't bring any big packages for mommy today; now she's gonna be mad...

Mommy's talking to the TLC person on the phone right now and her mouth looks mean. She's not giggling and using her happy-little-girl voice either so when she hangs up, I better be real good.

Especially when my kids were little,one of the hardest things for me to do was maintain a consistent environment no matter what else was going on. Everything from my mood to what time we had meals,to how long I spent on the phone when my mother called,to how I spoke to my husband,to the temperature of their bath water could be counted on by my children. Of course I had an occasional 'come apart' but even those were predictable in how I behaved.

Children need a sense of connectedness in order to feel safe and thrive; it's the least a parent can do. A budget busting unexpected expense or a cancelled vacation was not worth going to pieces over; what kind of example is that for children who are modeling their behavior after yours'?

Inconsistency in a child's life, I believe, is just plain "CRAZY MAKING."

Anonymous said...

I have posted many times about how I feel about KON, but I am also disgusted with the producers at TLC for allowing and promoting this garbage.

I seriously don't know what I would do if my husband were involved in something like this.

On one hand, it's a show that exploits very young children while lavishing the greedy, ungrateful parents with freebies and grand trips.

On the other hand, my husband has a job to do and his own family to support.

What would you all do?

Carla said...

If they are spanking only when the cameras aren't filming (which they've admitted to) what is that going to teach the kids? Sounds like "Hitting you is our dirty little secret" to me :=(

NDBT said...

anon 1:05 made me literally laugh out loud. I work at a child care center and have worked with all ages from 6 weeks to 5 years. At one point I was one of two teachers in a room of 24 3-5 year olds (there was a 12:1 ratio for that age group.) Most of my kids never behaved like the Gosselin kids do. However, we did have a select few that did, and we learned from the parents that they weren't using the same discipline at home that we used at school. The inconsistency (not to mention the physical punishments) brought out even worse behavior in those kids.

J&K admit to spanking, but when they're being filmed (3-4 days out of the week) they can't do it. These children are at an age where they absolutely NEED consistency: they push buttons and get in trouble to learn boundaries. Most of the time the behavior of the children is appalling, but I don't feel bad because J&K are bringing it upon themselves.

I'm so tired of hearing that it's just "hard" to deal with that many children all at once, or that they "can't do" as many things because of how many kids there are. We do more things with 24 children than parents of one child do, and guess what? 99.99% of the time, it works. We walk them on the street using the same rings the Gosselins have; we do water tables, messy painting, and countless other activities.

As long as you have a consistent way of dealing with bad behavior, and you put realistic expectations on the kids and let them know what is expected of them, they'll follow through. They may be young, but children are very smart and capable of so much more than parents think they are.

jana said...

My Lord! They have 8 kids for cryin' out loud! Whether or not you're on a "reality" show, consistent discipline is difficult...I only have 2 children and it's trying.

Karen said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
JKFan07 said...

Lordy be, if these kids are better behaved than your students, God help you. Where is your class held ~ Leavenworth or Attica?
----------
a little harsh are we?
have you dealt with 4 years old? I doubt it by your response to the person who left this comment.
No parent is perfect, and every child is different and should not be disciplined the same.

Anonymous said...

Kate pacifies Mady all the time. If you knew that your bad behavior would get attention from your mother, attention that caters to what you want why wouldn't a child keep it up.
There is definately a lot of hitting, screaming and jealousy happening. Although, they have learned in order to get attention you scream from Kate. I am sure it is difficult to alway know who did what but a problem occurs when you see someone do somthing and you do nothing or shout at your husband to handle the problem. This happens quite frequently. Those that think these children behave well have different standards than a lot of us. I had a sister quite a bit older than I she had children when I was still in high school. One time I picked up one by grabbing their arm and pulling it above their head (kate does this all the time ) my mother told me never to do that again it could dislocate their shoulder. I don't know if it could dislocate their shoulder but every time I see Kate load those kids in the van by picking them up that way I cringe.

diane said...

Hopefully, going to pre-school will help remind Jon and Kate what four years olds can do. You would think they would remember as they have older children, but, as Kate reminds us, they (allegedly) have not slept much in four years.

This makes me remember back to when the show first started. Mady and Cara were around the same age as the tups are now. IIRC, they were both reading at that point (clearly at an advanced level for their age). Yet the tups at the same age now are wearing bibs and treated like babies and some have extremely poor speech/grammar. The striking difference makes me quite sad because obviously Jon and Kate had been doing something right with Mady and Cara up to that point as they seemed to be sweet, mature, intelligent, responsible daughters and big sisters. Ever since then it seems to have all gone down hill for them.

I think Kate is determined to keep the sextuplets "babies" as long as she can and has no idea the damage being done.

Anonymous said...

I did not know that Alexis was forced to sleep in the basement as a sort of punishment.I thought it was just something she liked to do to be by herself. Am I wrong?

Anonymous said...

I did not know that Alexis was forced to sleep in the basement as a sort of punishment.I thought it was just something she liked to do to be by herself. Am I wrong?

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In one episode, Kate said that Alexis was banished to the basement because she was waking up Leah and Hannah.

In another episode (obvious damage control) Kate said that Alexis likes sleeping down there because she thinks she's a bat (something like that). Just one of many contradictions/lies that plague this show.

On an older thread, there were MANY comments on this - it was a very hot topic.

Anonymous said...

Anon at 7:06- No, Alexis did not choose to sleep in the basement. Jon and Kate put her down there because they said she was waking up the other kids at night.

Anonymous said...

she was put in the basement because she was waking the other kids up at 4am. so I guess it was forced.

Anonymous said...

Those who say that because they have eight kids we should cut them a little slack - that it's hard to discipline so many children - need to remember that these children are going to grow up in a society that expects them to behave appropriately regardless of how many siblings they had. We can't allow excuses for bad behavior as adults - "I had seven siblings, my mother could not possibly have disciplined me well, I deserve a break." If they won't discipline them now, then when?

Also, Mady is continually punished by Kate for the same behavior Kate exhibits all the time. Kate overreacts and has meltdowns several times a day, yet nobody removes her so that her ugliness doesn't rub off on everybody else.
How great would it be to see Jon on the couch, alone, saying "Kate was having another of her petty meltdowns so we decided she couldn't participate tonight. We don't want her ugliness to ruin it for the rest of us."

Anonymous said...

I don't think its amazing or out of the ordinary for a 3 or 4 year old to go to time out without making a fuss. They do cry on the way there and that is their way of rebelling but only really disturbed kids will not go to time out when told to. Believe it or not, most kids are good and do as their parents say especially when they know they've done something to deserve the time out. I think the problem is when they don't think they did anything wrong like when Hannah was thrown in time out all because she didn't want to eat her cereal with milk. Kate can be so brutal. She is a bully!

Anonymous said...

I have to say...all this talk about Mady acting out is because of the show...I totally disagree with. I do think having cameras on these kids is causing an adverse affect to their personalities. Cara is withdrawn and Mady is tempermental. They both have experienced life pre-cameras. But what Mady is experiencing is typical jealousy. She is jealous of the attention the sextuplets get. It's as simple as that. We have all seen older siblings act out when a new baby is born into the home. Picture how she feels with six new babies! That should not dismiss her behavior, but her behavior should be dealt with that in mind. Our children sometimes take on our personality traits. Plain and simple, she's her mom. The cameras certainly don't help, but she is clearly jealous of her younger siblings. In most episodes she displays that. I think if they had one more or six more the results of her behavior would be the same.

KathyGriffith said...

My issues with their discipline run deep. Inconsistent, to say the least. Different rules for different days for different children. Not only does this fuel poor behavior, but it drives wedges between the children, causing them to resent the favored ones.
I agree that it is good practice not to spank on camera .... and yet, I doubt their motives. I believe they do not air this footage as it would turn off a great number of viewers. Very few people want to see a child get struck, even if those parents utilize physical punishment. I doubt their motives are to preserve the childrens dignity or privacy, because we have seen them profit from those very things.

The most glaring mistake I see, though, is the way (Kate especially) ignores the childrens feelings. Time outs are a great tool when a child is over-stimulated and needs to be removed from the situation. However, the key is to talk to the child afterwards! When everyone is calm, let the child express his/her feelings, and then mom/dad can explain the rules in an age appropriate manner. The worst is when Kate responds to the children who express emotions .... by punishing them. Miss your daddy? That's against the rules! Time out!
Mady is often talked about as the one with the most obvious behavior issues. However, I see her behavior explained away or punished.
Remember when Katie was begging for the state-financed nurse? She said that she needed time to take care of the kids and "talk about feelings." Well, she has plenty of help now, what is stopping her?

Anonymous said...

For those who think children that behave worse than the Gosselins need serious help should consider a couple things before jumping to conclusions. First of all, you make these assumptions based on the small block of time to which you are exposed each week. Therefore, since we all know the show is edited to be the most entertaining, it makes sense that we will see more of the children misbehaving. Second, the Gosselins have already been forced to learn to share and get along with other individuals their age, which is generally a common behavioral problem among young children. Lastly, we have actually had a chance to see them in a classroom environment. We saw the children go to daycare while Jon and Kate went to church. As I recall, the caretakers had only good things to say about the sextuplets' behavior. Yes, they do hit, push and cry, but not to the extent that they would require "serious help." I think we should stop focusing on the children's flaws and instead look to the parents. I would hate for this blog to somehow inadvertently reflect poorly on the Gosselin children. They've already been subjected to enough!

Anonymous said...

I am offended by the Moons in Leo and Anon 2:54 comments. I teach a head start program for kids in families that could not otherwise afford pre-school. Believe it or not, the Gosselins seem to be much better behaved than the children in my classroom. I work very hard to instill the best behavior I can in my students. You are criticizing my ability to control my students just to make a point about the Gosselin children. Arguing your point at another's expense is no better than Jon and Kate.

I have been a fan of this blog for quite a while. On occasion, I have found some comments to be a little harsh, but I have never once felt uneasy about expressing my opinion until now.

Kassie said...

I have already commented 2 times but I got one more. I have heard a saying that says "Just don't be there be AWARE"!!! And sometimes I can be in the same room with my kids and not even know that some one is getting a toy taken away, or getting a ball tossed at them until they star a screamin. So things that I do see happen on J&K som times I think they honestly just don't see it.

Anonymous said...

"First let me say that I can not stand Kon and do not even wish them well at this point. BUT I have always been amazed at how easily and consistently the kids, when told to go to a corner, do it without fighting, without explaining, and stay there until they are told to get up. So something is going right and something is consistent."

The fact that the children don't question going to time out, don't bawk at it or cry tells me something is wrong. Why are they so robotic about something other children protest? Is there something else going on that we don't see?

Real Mom said...

The tups were not great in preschool. They got red and yellow lights everyday.

Anonymous said...

When I first started watching the show the thing that shocked me was the amount of hitting and screaming the Gosselin kids do. NEVER in my family did kids hit and scream like that.

My brother and his wife had 4 children within 5 years, so there was not a great age difference between them. I never once saw the kids hit each other. But then again, my brother and his wife would not tolerate that type of behavior. Yes the kids had melt downs from time to time but they never hit each other and never screamed at the top of their lungs if a toy was taken away from them or if one of the other kids touched their hair or whatever.

I think that consistency in discipline is vital. In my generation we were little afraid of our parents because they were authority figures in our lives. That doesn't mean that I lived in fear of my parents, just that I had enough fear to respect the boundries they set forth. When they made a rule I followed it. I didn't ignore them or turn around and smack one of my siblings or have a temper tantrum.

The Gosselins children are allowed to act wild because J&K haven't got the time or the focus to make them mind. So when they grow up what will they be like since they had no healthy boundries growing up?

Anonymous said...

As I recall, the caretakers had only good things to say about the sextuplets' behavior.

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Their behavior very well could have been great, but I would hope that trained teachers would NOT say otherwise on national tv.

dotsicle said...

Anonymous said...

"The one where I saw Mady flinch was the one where they went to Thomas the Train. I can't remember the name of the other one."

There was the time when the 6 were in strollers and getting their hands Purell'd, and Alexis started licking her hand. Jon grabbed her hand and pulled it away and Alexis did flinch as if she expected something more.
I am a pro-spanker. I do NOT think that J&K "beat" their kids, but sometimes a spank works wonders and if the Gosselins spank,that's their business.

another Anonymous said:
"...But what Mady is experiencing is typical jealousy. She is jealous of the attention the sextuplets get. It's as simple as that...."
You hit the nail on the head. If the show were called "Mady and her Siblings" or "Mady and Cara + 8", Mady would be astonishingly well-behaved. The twins were good with the tups when they were babies, but as soon as Mady realized the little ones were stealing her thunder, jealousy took over.
I went through similar stuff when I was young, being the first girl in the family. I was treated like a princess and a star until my sister was born. Sis became the star and I was quite jealous for a few years. Mady will get over it eventually.

Anonymous said...

I am one of 8. We grew up in a very similar manner to the Gosselins. Mom was a nurse,Mom had favorites,Mom was inconsistent in every way, Mom was controlling and at times irrational...etc You get the point. I was the "Mady" in the family. I behaved like her for 2 reasons. 1) Because I desperately wanted/needed my mothers love and attention and did not know any other way to get it. When I wasn't melting down, she was not paying any attention to me. 2) Because this was my "role" in the family. It was what was expected of me. If you raise the bar and change your style, the child will change their behavior. I feel for Mady. She's trying to say something very important and no one is listening. I think Mady's issues are very different from the others' hitting and tantrums. Mady needs someone who is going to ask her what's wrong and really listen. I think it's ironic that they air on the TLC chanel when thats what Mady needs...TLC. I think Mady behaves as she does because she knows that it will get her a "time out" from being on camera.

As for the tups, well again, they hit and scream for attention. But, also, it's about control. In a child's sense it's control over the toy or the game but in a real sense it's because they don't often get time or toys for themselves. They need more than inconsistent time outs. They need to learn to take turns and each needs a turn to be first. The Dilleys used to have a chore chart and the rewards were alone time with a parent or alone time with a video game or first choice at picking the movie for that night etc. I think that's the idea.

People are right about the future where these kids will resent each other. That's what has happened with us. My siblings and I are not all in touch with each other. We all live near each other and there is no falling out but there is a definite division. We aren't all close.

Can't believe Mady's Behavior said...

The older episode where J&K took Cara & Mady to the American Girl Theater in New York for their birthday was a good example of Mady's extreme behavior.

Mady pitched a fit outside the door to the theater because she didn't like it that it had been a surprise (?) or something ridiculous like that.

Later on, as the episode was coming to a conclusion, Kate said her twins were "very good girls".

Hellooooooooo?

Mady has serious issues, including a sense of entitlement for starters.

Anonymous said...

Yes, I agree that Mady is punished for being so like Katie Irene. Why can't she see that identically mimics Kate's own behavior? Why hasn't anyone clued her in -- or have they?

I have five kids, five little stair step kids, as they are called. I don't hit them, they don't hit each other as far as I know and I don't hit my husband. This is not to say that the kids have never hit, but believe me when I tell you it is a rare occasion that is dealt with right away. So we don't have the constant head smacking and screaming the G's have going on. I would not be able to deal with it.

I was the lesser child in my own home as a kid. To this very day I am aware of it, remember every put down, every treat granted another in my presence. The boys will remember if not the words, then the feeling of being less. And there is nothing they can do about it. I tried being good, being sweeter than the others, sucking up, being quiet -- anything. It simply did no good. So I am acutely aware of the gravity of Kon's actions with regard to Alexis and the boys and it fills me with real sadness.

Kon didn't deserve these wonderful children and they are doing everything in their power to show that each and every day. Kids almost five years old who are talking baby talk, wearing bibs and drinking from sippy cups are going to have it rough. I'm very sad for them. No pretty clothes, pretty matching clothing will help.

Anonymous said...

The fact that the children don't question going to time out, don't bawk at it or cry tells me something is wrong. Why are they so robotic about something other children protest? Is there something else going on that we don't see?
-----------------------------------

As much as I dont agree with alot of what goes on on J&K, I have to say that there is absolutely nothing wrong with a child going to time out with out throwing a fit. I have 4 kids of my own all very close in age and work with kids of all ages for a living, and the only thing that a child going to sit in the corner without screaming indicates is that that child has been taught that there are consequences for thier negative actions and even BIGGER consequences if they sit there and scream. To me that indicates a child who IS punished and not allowed to run all over everybody. NOW, with that being said, I am not saying that is the case with J&K, to me I think I have seen the kids QUITE a few times throw a fit in the corner..at lease most of them. Cara is one that wil sit quietly and Collin too usually.

I also have to address that with the very first episode I ever watched, the first thing that shocked me was ALL THAT HITTING!! That is AWFUUL that those little kids are allowed to hit like that. And their reactions when one of them takes a toy away from them is unbelievavble. By age 3, kids are MORE that capable of understanding that you need to tell mom instead of just reacting when someone does something to you. Not saying that they will do that all the time, but at least part of the time. My 8 year old (who is probably the most obedient out of all my kids) just got in trouble this morning for hitting her sister and one of the rules in our house is NO HITTING!! I tie my kids hand together with a shoe string and they have to go about life like that (at home), it turns into a joke and everyone is laughing (including the perpetrator) as they try to eat a sandwich or play on the computer..but it gets the point across. (By the way, my kids are all 8 and up..I dont recommend this for all ages) Anyway, my point is hitting will happen occasionally even in the most monitored homes, because face it, kids are natural born sinners, but as parents we have to make sure that our children understand that that is not they way the world works and it is not acceptable. That doesnt mean they WONT do it, just means we have to punish when they do, and I dont see much of that at all from J&K.

Anonymous said...

I am offended by the Moons in Leo and Anon 2:54 comments. I teach a head start program for kids in families that could not otherwise afford pre-school. Believe it or not, the Gosselins seem to be much better behaved than the children in my classroom. I work very hard to instill the best behavior I can in my students. You are criticizing my ability to control my students just to make a point about the Gosselin children. Arguing your point at another's expense is no better than Jon and Kate.


I've been a master teacher for 15 years working with student teachers, new teachers, and teachers needing improvement. I've taught head start also. Might I suggest that the reason for the comments is that if you are "doing your best" and your students still are worse than J&K's kids that people see that something could perhaps be amiss? If that is truly the case you might suffer from what I've seen here. The colleges do not teach adequate classroom management skills. I have yet to get a student teacher who was prepared to handle the full classroom unless he/she had some other experience. For your sake and the children's consider finding a teacher who has a well run, quiet, orderly classroom and get some pointers. The first week of school I teach the kids the rules of the classroom. If there is chaos and misbehavior, there will be little to no learning. Start with we use our inside voices inside, no running indoors, when I'm talking to the class no one else is, and no hurting anyone else. One of the best pieces of advice came from my own supervising teacher all those many years ago. She said start out like dumping a load of bricks on them. You can always lighten up, but tightening down is very difficult. It sounded a bit harsh at the time, but it's true.

Moons in Leo said...

JKFan07 said...
Lordy be, if these kids are better behaved than your students, God help you. Where is your class held ~ Leavenworth or Attica?
----------
a little harsh are we?
have you dealt with 4 years old? I doubt it by your response to the person who left this comment.
No parent is perfect, and every child is different and should not be disciplined the same.


Not that I wasn't being a tad facetious, but yes, I have successfully raised two children who are happy, healthy productive members of society.

Good way to get kids to stop hitting, etc., don't tolerate it. It is possible to show children the proper way to behave without beatings and screaming. I've done it.

Moons in Leo said...

Anonymous said...
I am offended by the Moons in Leo and Anon 2:54 comments. I teach a head start program for kids in families that could not otherwise afford pre-school. Believe it or not, the Gosselins seem to be much better behaved than the children in my classroom. I work very hard to instill the best behavior I can in my students. You are criticizing my ability to control my students just to make a point about the Gosselin children. Arguing your point at another's expense is no better than Jon and Kate.

How could I be criticizing you when I don't even know you? Honestly, my remark using Leavenworth and Attica was supposed to be funny, for the most part; however, I do not see the Gosselins as being any sort of role models for good behavior.

Raising your children or teaching someone else's are admittedly two different things.

I'm sure you're doing a fabulous job.

highQ said...

Anonymous said...
I don't think its amazing or out of the ordinary for a 3 or 4 year old to go to time out without making a fuss. They do cry on the way there and that is their way of rebelling but only really disturbed kids will not go to time out when told to. Believe it or not, most kids are good and do as their parents say especially when they know they've done something to deserve the time out. I think the problem is when they don't think they did anything wrong like when Hannah was thrown in time out all because she didn't want to eat her cereal with milk. Kate can be so brutal. She is a bully!
________________________________

OMG! What a crazy statement. "only really disturbed kids will not go to time out when told to." My 3yr old is in no way shape or form "disturbed" and when told to go to T.O she does not go. I have to place her there. She will stay but not go on her own. What a bold (and wrong) statement to make. I bet you do not have children.

natasha said...

"I am a pro-spanker. I do NOT think that J&K "beat" their kids, but sometimes a spank works wonders and if the Gosselins spank,that's their business."

I agree. My issue was simply that if the punishment should fit the crime, what happens if the crime happens but the punishment isn't the same day-to-day due to their lifestyle or simply their choice not to MAKE it the same, for whatever reason? Wouldn't that sort of confusion and inconsistency cause MORE behavior problems?

Take the analogy of someone trying to get healthy or lose weight. Monday, Wednesday and Friday, they eat right and exercise. They're doing great and are proud of themselves. But they never lose weight or get in better shape because Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday they sit on their couch for 23 out of 24 hours and eat pizza & ice cream. Are they getting the results they want?

highQ said...

I think the way the parents discipline work well. The kids DO listen, and when told NO they do not cry or have a tantrum like many 3 and 4 yr olds do. My 3yr old is in preschool and many of the kids in her class have their moments and act worse then I have ever seen the G's kids act. I think what they are doing is working. BUT the older 2 have some problem, they seem to really be crying out for attention. I think they need to address the problem of the older 2 more rather then to say they are hunger/low blood sugar/just being Maddy and such. They need to sit down and really talk to them and see what the REAL problem is with them. IMO

Anonymous said...

My aunt had 7 children, one right after another... When they were very little, my mom or my grandmother would go over to help her a bit, but she took care of the daily routine on her own, while my uncle worked. AND she cooked a big dinner every night, and ironed dress shirts for all the boys,(six of them) every day for school.
we had 4 children in our family. The 11 of us grew up the best of friends and went on numerous outings together. NEVER did we hit or scream.
Get a grip, Kate. There are other "large families" in the world that have survived, without mom complaining every minute about being SO EXHAUSTED and ready to "LOSE MY MIND".

Anonymous said...

The older episode where J&K took Cara & Mady to the American Girl Theater in New York for their birthday was a good example of Mady's extreme behavior.

Mady pitched a fit outside the door to the theater because she didn't like it that it had been a surprise (?) or something ridiculous like that.

Later on, as the episode was coming to a conclusion, Kate said her twins were "very good girls".

Hellooooooooo?

Mady has serious issues, including a sense of entitlement for starters.

-------------------------

You beat me to it - the American Girl trip was the one that stuck out in my head regarding Mady's behavior.

I think Mady's behavior is a combination of everything posted here:

Her basic personality is very spirited, emotional and sensitive. The jealousy factor absolutely does have an impact as does the constant filming, as does the manner in which Kate constantly brushes her off.

How many times have we seen Mady put her hand out in front of the camera, not to mention the infamous sign she put on her study room door?

I think Mady is extremely bright and insightful - I also think KON are not filming her as much as before because they know Mady is prone to outbursts of the truth. I don't think she has a sense of entitlement - she is just a very frustrated little girl.

Anonymous said...

"The tups were not great in preschool. They got red and yellow lights everyday."

Ok, I'll try again, this is simply not true.

I would love to know who your source is.

One of the sextuplets got a red twice, in the beginning of the year. Since then occasionally one may get a yellow. Yellow is not "bad". It is a warning.

Many in the class have gotten a yellow at some point. They are give the chance to go back from yellow to green during the day.

Please check your source. You are wrong.

My child is in their class. They are not discipline problems. They do not get reds and yellows everyday.

Lisa said...

Wow, people - we don't need to be turning on one another! Of course, we all see "discipline" as we define it & how we were introduced to it. I personally cannot imagine having the responsibility of raising 8 children, and that initially drew my interest to J&KP8 - to see how they did it. But now I have come to learn that they have much more help, both physically & financially, than they led us all to believe from the very beginning. We truly cannot believe anything KON says, whether it be in terms of how they discipline or what the children eat. All we can do is go by what we see on TV and that being said, I feel the children are lacking the individual attention they need. They act out in order to get it and as result, are punished for it. Instead of KON taking the time to explain why the behavior is unacceptable or listen to the child to find the root of the problem, they simply choose not to deal with it at all and either put them in time-out or exclude them altogether (Mady).

Anonymous said...

There was a segment when Jon took one of the boys with him to run an errand. Aaden wanted to go. With all his heart he wanted to go. He wanted to go in the worst way imaginable. My heart broke for that little guy when he was put in the corner. He was really, really crying. Kate told him to go upstairs if he was going to keep crying. Up he went, heart broken and screaming all the way.

I thought of how Dr Hiam Ginott (spelling?) might have treated this situation. He would have recognized the agony this little boy was in. Dr Ginott would have held this little boy and said something like,"I see you wanted to go with your brother and your Dad, didn't you?" Then Aaden would have looked up into Dr Ginott's face and would have seen understanding. Dr Ginott would have said something like, "You wish it was your turn to go this time, don't you?" Aaden would have said "Yes, I do wish it was my turn." Dr Ginott might have said, "Won't it be nice when it is your turn again?" Aaden might have said, "Yes, but I really wanted to go this time." Dr Ginott might have hugged Aaden's little body close to his chest and said something like, "Yes, it is hard not to get to go everytime." Aaden, would probably agree and shake his head yes. Dr Ginott might have said, "I am sorry you are feeling sad and left out. It will be a good thing when it is your time once again." Aaden would realize he had been understood.

I love Aaden so much. I did so want to hold that sad little boy in my lap. He just really WANTED to go. Kate would have behaved at least this badly if she were the one that wanted to go and was not allowed to, because it wasn't her turn. Heck, why can't two boys or three boys go once in a while. It is good to give them individual attention, because they do deserve that much, but dang it, can't rules be softened once in a while????

Anonymous said...

IMHO Kate feels mentioning Mady not being in a scene is part of her punishment (kind of like rubbing it in). What loving, caring parent does that to their child?

----------------------------

IMO I don't believe Kate was punishing Mady by explaining her absence. I believe she explained it to avoid speculation. I have read on many different blogs where people speculate on the absence of one of the children. Cara mainly. People were assuming because she wasn't there that she "must be tired of being filmed." When really it could have been for any reason.

Also, about the spanking. Just because they say it doesn't happen on camera doesn't mean it doesn't happen when they are filming or with the camera crew around. J&K could have put that in their contract with Figure 8 that any footage of it be deleted.

In regard to the tups being "behind" Cara and Mady developementally. As a mother of a preemie this REALLY upsets me. They were born premature! Of course they are going to be delayed somewhat. This does not explain the bibs and sipping cups, however, it DOES explain their speech and developement.

diane said...

In regard to the tups being "behind" Cara and Mady developementally. As a mother of a preemie this REALLY upsets me. They were born premature! Of course they are going to be delayed somewhat. This does not explain the bibs and sipping cups, however, it DOES explain their speech and developement.

Why does it really upset you? No one is talking about your children. All preemies are not developmentally behind. It could be a possible explanation for the tups issues, however my twin sister and I were born premature and did not have any developmental issues like the tups have. Heck, its also possible that Cara and Mady themselves were premature (I don't know this for a fact, just speculating. Has it ever been discussed by J&K?)

ThreeFarmers said...

If you want to watch live streaming of six youn'uns who truly behave like animals, click HERE.

I prefer the full screen setting.

4thekids said...

I'm re-watching the episode where the family goes to visit Hershey, Ronald McDonald, and the timeshare (and boy is there a wealth of information in this epi!)

But in case you wanted to see a case of spanking being covered up, check out 55 minutes in. Mady loses her mind in the kitchen so Kate sends her in the back room with Jon. She screams really loudly but it's mostly covered up by Kate's camera talk, and then John comes out saying REALLY nicely "I'll get your breakfast, just get dressed," and she's still screaming bloody murder. Having been around kids long enough, I know a painful cry from an angry cry.

(BTW I'm all for a spanking for really bad behavior, so I'm not judging...just putting this out there for all the people who doubt that they spank.)

Anonymous said...

Why does it really upset you? No one is talking about your children. All preemies are not developmentally behind.


-------------------------------

No not all preemies are delayed, but we are not talking about all preemies we're talking about the Gosselin tups. It has been mentioned on numerous occasions (here and elsewhere) that the tups don't speak or behave as other 4 year olds, without acknowledging that they were in fact premature and that that is very likely the reason for their delay.

Mom to 5 little sunflowers said...

I have been a quiet reader of your site and wanted to comment ont he discipline thread. While every parent does parent differently, as well as discipline, I still feel there are plenty of postive opportunities to discipline consistently even while the cameras are rolling or not. I know certain behaviors certainly call for unique measures, but all children need the ability to realize consequences and age appropriate one's at that. I agree with your statement about consistency. I feel if they find a method that is comfortable for them, they should be able to utilize it whether the cameras are on or not.

Anonymous said...

We can disagree about the techniques J&K are using with Mady all day in regards to her behavior/outbursts, etc. but my question/issue the whole thing is why show any of it or bring it up in the first place?
============================

I've been watching Nanny 911 lately during the day, and I've noticed a lot of behaviors in the kids on that show, that are on KON's show. Especially the ones with multiples, or many young children at once. I believe the nannies call this taunting the children.
While I don't like this being shown on TV, I am glad that there is help out there for some parents that don't now how to control their children, and it usually ends up being something that the parents are doing that makes the children act out the way they do.
I think that's another way of Kate's to punish Mady, is by saying on the show that this is why we aren't seeing Mady.
The other thing that amazes me, is it's usually the ones with the nice houses, and huge incomes on there. Not sure if that's all that are applying for the show, but it seems kind of odd.
I no longer watch the show, but whenever I pass by it when changing channels, it makes me sick to my stomach. Still writing though.

momforthekids said...

Diane,

I have to agree with you 100% . All preemies are NOT developmentally behind. Two of my sons were born premature and neither one of them have developmental issues. My youngest child Luke, was born at 24 weeks. The doctors told us that it didn't look good for him. He had all kinds of tubes and IV'S. He was a fighter. The doctors said that there was a great chance that he would be really behind other kids his age. Now he is in the first grade and is in the gifted program. He's the smartest boy in his class. The doctors were wrong.

No mother should get REALLY upset about any thing that's said about a premature child. Every child is different and develops differently.

Anonymous said...

No mother should get REALLY upset about any thing that's said about a premature child. Every child is different and develops differently.

-----------------------

I just have to address this one more time. The reason I said I was REALLY upset was because people were saying J&K were at fault for the tups not speaking or behaving like other children their age. They were being compared to Cara and Mady and Kate was being blamed for babying them. It is obvious the tups have some delays (especially in speech)and instead of some people realizing that delays CAN come with prematurity they blame the parents. That is what REALLY upsets me. I'm glad your 24 weeker is doing so well. My daughter was born at 27 weeks and is also doing wonderfully. So I know not all preemies have long term issues. Unfortuately, there are some who do.

Anonymous said...

Three Farmers
Thanks for the streaming video of the puppies. That was very funny!

mollybloom said...

We don't see a lot about how Jon and Kate discipline these children. However, we do see how Jon and Kate themselves act. Kate is a whining, attention-seeking drama queen. She slaps and denigrates her husband in front of the children. She's lazy and greedy. She openly prefers some children over others. Jon tries, but gosh, he'd rather be surfing. The man doesn't have a job. He mocks his children. The choices of the situations in which they allow their children to be filmed don't suggest strong adult boundaries. They have shut out other family members who might bring in experience and balance. My experience is that the loved children of mature, fully integrated adults usually do well. I don't know why anyone would expect these children to behave better than their parents. The exhausted, plead-eight excuses are lame. Jon and Kate created this family and are now responsible for any and all problems. The children are young and simply living what they know.

diane said...

It is obvious the tups have some delays (especially in speech)and instead of some people realizing that delays CAN come with prematurity they blame the parents. That is what REALLY upsets me.

I understand your point, however you can't take the parenting out of the equation altogether. I have not noticed as much "articulation" speech problems with the tups as the obvious grammatical ones (him instead of he, etc..). That is something that can easily be corrected by simple repetition of the proper phrasing by a parent. The speech teacher at my school (I teach Kdg) has told me numerous times that articulation problems tend to be age-related (kids will grow out of them), whereas other speech/language problems such as pronoun replacement, not speaking in complete sentences, or being able to express ideas clearly are things they need to be taught. This is done by expressing ideas clearly yourself and speaking properly to your child and also by gently correcting them when they are misspeaking.

I have a 5 year old little girl in my class this year who was not exhibiting the same level of maturity as most of her peers in September. I noticed a lot of 'baby talk' and poor communication skills in general. One example...when she was finished with her work she would come to me and say "I can go play?" to which I would simply say "Can I go play?" (she would repeat it) and I would say yes. Within 1 month she was phrasing her questions properly with no prompting. She would also say things like "We go bye-bye?" at the end of the day. After several times of being corrected to say "Are we going home now?" she began to say that properly on her own as well. It just takes a little attention and concern from a grown up to help children develop oral language skills and vocabulary.

guin said...

Kate and Jon stunt all the kids' development simply by isolating them from other kids.

Anonymous said...

The other thing that amazes me, is it's usually the ones with the nice houses, and huge incomes on there.

-----------------------

Total generalization. Basically you are implying that people with $ are always the ones that need help parenting ?

I've seen plenty of Nanny 911 episodes myself- I think all demographics have been covered.

WhateverKate said...

A blatant example of J & K inconsistencie with respect to discipline is in the episode where J & K the tups to the place (sorry I recall the name) sort of like Bounce U.
Jon reprimands one of the boy tups for hitting or pushing one of his siblings. Jon removed the boy tup from the activity and placed him on a bench and told him to sit. Kate then reprimands JON for disciplining the child and informs Jon that SHE does not want the tups to be disciplined while at 'Bounce U'. In which Jon responds, 'well I wasnt informed that rules of discpline went out the window while at Bounce U.'
So according to Kate, a child may or may not be disciplined for inappropriate behavior it all depends on the locality of the inappropriate behavior and whether or not the location is one that has been personally approved and deemed by her as discipline appropriate?!
And this is the woman that is giving 'parental tips' via TLC's website!!!

dolphinfoxx said...

I think that not only are their delays due to prematurity, but also because there are 6 of them. It's harder to correct them all the time with having that many around.

ilovehaters said...

I can tell you why Mady acts the way that she does. It's because she is just like Kate. The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

Can some one please tell me why it's called sixgosselins.com and not eightgosselins? After all, there are eight children. Why do Jon and Kate leave out Mady and Cara?

Anonymous said...

I think Mady is extremely bright and insightful - I also think KON are not filming her as much as before because they know Mady is prone to outbursts of the truth. I don't think she has a sense of entitlement - she is just a very frustrated little girl.

I could not agree more. Think of how irritating Kate is just watching her on TV. Think about how angry it makes us to hear her lies and justifications. How disgusting it is to watch her play obvious favorites with the kids. How confusing it is trying to figure out where Beth, Aunt Jodi, and other friends/family are. How tedious the travelling and photos are to watch. How irritating it is to see Kate turn from screaming to telling the kids to smile for the camera to make happy memories.

The reactions on this blog are very strong--just from watching for a very brief time and from afar. Even seeing how awful it is, we can thank the lord that it's not our lives and we can turn Kon off when it gets too horrendously horrendous. AND we can come here and vent and get validation that their behavior is, indeed, completely insane.

But those kids see 100x what we see. And they are stuck smack dab in the middle of it with no way out, no lifetime of perspective or coping skills to deal, and very little voice.

As much as we want to bonk Kon upside the head, think about if you had to listen to their b.s. day in and day out, and they were the ones telling you when, where, and how about every aspect of your life. I just can't fault Mady for losing it all the time. As I've said before, I think it's actually a *really* good sign that she's already rebelling against those two nitwits. I think it says a lot about her mental health, actually. She's not sheeple! She's calling them on their behavior, she's refusing to go along with their garbage, and she doesn't seem to respect them. I don't really see how we can blame her.

Anonymous said...

It has been mentioned on numerous occasions (here and elsewhere) that the tups don't speak or behave as other 4 year olds, without acknowledging that they were in fact premature and that that is very likely the reason for their delay.
******
Doubtful. By almost 5 they would have caught up, at least some of them would have. If the parents believed they were delayed, speech therapy and other help would have been in order, not sheltering them from ever playing with other children and barely being around anyone outside of immediate family.

Barb said...

Just found a site that interviewed Kate. It's from Religion News Service and called 10 minutes with Kate.

http://www.religionnews.com/index.php?/tenminutes/kate_gosselin/

I found something new to me, I didn't know Jon was raised Catholic.

Anonymous said...

My child is in their class. They are not discipline problems. They do not get reds and yellows everyday.
------------
Sorry, not sure I believe this. I don't see why a parent of another child in class would be privvy to this information. The teacher is not going to go around announcing this. Would one prod their child for this information and believe the accuracy of a 4 year old? This is just odd. Why would a parent of a child in their class suddenly come out and start posting information here when there have been many, many instances to tell what they know about situations?

Anonymous said...

whateverkate:

the episode you describe is when they go to a PRIVATE Gymboree class.

Anonymous said...

anonymous said,
My child is in their class.
_________________

I don't believe it either. Please, do you think we were just born yesterday? Those tups are not socailized enough. Kate and Jon keep them isolated way to much. They will have severe problems later in life.

calebsmom said...

Barb,

I just read that interview with Kate. What a joke Kate is. Just more BS. She sure can talk the talk, but can't walk the walk.

Robin said...

I found it curious why we did not see Mady's misbehavior that caused her not to participate in the Hawaii chef class..the bad behavior is what makes the show interesting - especially Mady's...it's not a good episode without at least one Mady breakdown...

I guess the behavior must have happened in their suite..which by the way, other than showing the family check in we never saw the suite again...I bet we won't see it in the wedding finale next week either...guess the camaras aren't allowed in as many places as before...if the show only shows them in public, to me that's not a show and clear evidence of scripting and control of what we see...that's not reality, that's a play...

sharpmom4 said...

Anon 8:37 said...


anonymous said,
My child is in their class.
_________________

I don't believe it either. Please, do you think we were just born yesterday? Those tups are not socailized enough. Kate and Jon keep them isolated way to much. They will have severe problems later in life.

--------------------

Not saying that the Anon poster does have a kid in the tup's preschool class..but THEY DO GO TO PRESCHOOL!! You say they are not
"socailized" (BTW SOCIALIZED) enough making it sound like they dont go to school..do you not watch the show?
Also, we have a church preschool in our town and as much as it shouldnt happen, those two teachers we have tend to spill the beans about other kids they teach. It is a individually run program (just like the tups') and if they want to run their mouths about the other kids they can. They teachers dont have a "school board" to report to. People in little towns gossip and when you have a teacher sitting next to a parent at a basketball game and preschool comes up, I can VERY easily see the teacher saying "You know those Gosselins kids are actually well behaved . They have only been red carded twice".

For the record I am not even so sure I care for J&K alot anymore, but saying that another parent couldnt get information about another child that info is privileged is way off mark. You'd be amazed at what people can find about your kids..spoken from a mom of 4.

Anonymous said...

I really don't care what you believe or not. I will NOT let people pass of wrong information as fact. Sorry.

I know because I unlike you, are around them three days a week for school. I am there, you are not.

Why haven't I "come forward before?"...because I don't wish to post personal information about them. I only did this time because it was a totally untrue thing being printed about their children.

You can attack the parents all you want, but I won't be silent when you print things about the kids that are simply not true.

Anonymous said...

It seems many people think that disciple in the Gosselin home is inconsistent because off camera they spank, while on camera they just do time outs and *very* firm grabbing... Well inconsistent or not, I don't think we can exactly assume they don't ever spank during filming. I remember the episode where they go to the zoo, the kids were in the penguin exhibit and Colin was misbehaving. It wasn't shown exactly what happened but when they were all back at their trolley Jon was mad at Kate for pushing Colin onto him and saying something like Kate was playing while he was disciplining his child, and Kate said something like, "Well usually the father handles that sort of thing," and Jon said, "And I do handle it." Sounds like they were talking about spanking to me.
Also I remember one episode where Alexis was screaming in time out in the garage and Jon grabbed her really hard by the arm and drug her inside and it just felt like there was a spanking coming and also that she knew it too. As far as I know they have only 1 cameraman (Scott), even if there was a second one there are still enough rooms in their house to be able to take a kid to a separate room in order to spank them off camera. Who knows what really goes on but it's a possibility.

I used to really love Jon and Kate but now I think: what happened to the Kate we first saw on a home video calmly saying it's time for baths and bedtime, and then the best part of the day Mommy's bedtime, with 6 screaming babies in the background and two toddlers hopping around and saying "bye" to the camera along with Kate, who had a smile on her face? I never expected her to be the way she is now. And Jon... the home video of Kate taping him washing one of his twin girls in the shower with him just melted my heart... now we see him yanking kids out of highchairs and yanking one of his little girl's arms. It really does make me sad.
Anyway just some thoughts.

chiasmus said...

anonymous 11/15/2008 3:00 PM said:
"Just because they say it doesn't happen on camera doesn't mean it doesn't happen when they are filming or with the camera crew around. J&K could have put that in their contract with Figure 8 that any footage of it be deleted."

How predictably consistently inconsistent.

WAIT! I think that I figured it out! They are following the Christian teaching "spare the rod, spoil the child." They must have to edit it out because it relates to their faith.

Just more of Kon's incoherent and conflicting prattle.

Anonymous said...

When anonymous came in defense of the sextuplets in preschool and had specific details of the "red light" and "yellow light" situation, the timing, and how many kids received them...your child is not in the class with them...these ARE your children. Kate, that was you responding to the comment. I am relieved to know that since I am hoping that some of these comments are taken to heart and eventually you'll see the damage this show is doing to your children.

diane said...

For the record I am not even so sure I care for J&K alot anymore, but saying that another parent couldnt get information about another child that info is privileged is way off mark. You'd be amazed at what people can find about your kids..spoken from a mom of 4.

I don't think its fair to say it is way off mark. MOST teachers are professional and are trained to never divulge information about other students in the class to different parents. Now, what parents hear from their own kids is another story LOL. I'm sure kids do go home and say "so and so was yellow" or red today because that happens in my own class. When parents have approached me about it (clearly trying to dig for info about the "misbehaving" children) I respond with something along the lines of "I'm trying to remind all of them to only worry about themselves." and that usually ends the conversation pretty quickly.

Anonymous said...

I found it curious why we did not see Mady's misbehavior that caused her not to participate in the Hawaii chef class..the bad behavior is what makes the show interesting - especially Mady's...it's not a good episode without at least one Mady breakdown...

------------------------------
I'm glad we don't see any more Mady breakdowns - it doesn't make the episode more "fun" for me, it makes me sad for her.

Anonymous said...

Sorry, not sure I believe this. I don't see why a parent of another child in class would be privvy to this information. The teacher is not going to go around announcing this. Would one prod their child for this information and believe the accuracy of a 4 year old? This is just odd.
____________________

Forgive me, but why is it odd for someone who allegedly has a child attending the tups' preschool to know information about disciplinary issues at school, but it is apparently not odd for someone who has only seen them on television to make blanket statements regarding how they're disciplined, how often they act up off camera, and how messed up they will be when they're adults?

Whether the person claiming to have a kid in their preschool class is telling the truth or not, I'd be more inclined to believe a statement that at least includes some indication of personal, firsthand knowledge rather than assumptions presented as fact from people who have only watched the show.

Anonymous said...

I think that not only are their delays due to prematurity, but also because there are 6 of them. It's harder to correct them all the time with having that many around.
______________________

Furthermore, unlike singletons, higher order multiples have more people their own age (and therefore with the same speech and grammar issues) influencing them than older people who can show them the correct way. A kid with pronoun issues surrounded by other kids with pronoun issues is not going to lose those issues as fast as a kid surrounded by older kids or adults speaking properly.

You can even apply that to the hitting they do. It's hard for a kid to learn proper behaviour when he or she is surrounded by kids who behave badly. As much as Jon and Kate need to step up a bit more in terms of ending the hitting, they can't be there all the time, and therefore can't stop every single instance of it. You can probably convince a kid that hitting is wrong, but throw that kid into a room where she's only surrounded by kids hitting each other and that lesson may be thrown out the window.

It's not an excuse, but rather a contributing factor.

pinkdiamond611 said...

Re: the poster whose child is in the tups PreK class. Are you saying that all the tups are in the same class? I do not think that this is a good situation, spoken as both a Kinder teacher and a Mom. First off, how many students are in the class? Having so many siblings in one class definitely influences the classroom dynamics. I would not want my child in a class with all six 'tups. Nothing personal against the 'tups. Any 'tups I would have the same opinion. I also wouldn't want to be their PreK teacher if they were all in the same class. First off, I would have to explain differentiating instruction to the parents. . . Then I would have to deal with the family dynamics which would spill into the classroom. (i.e. sibling rivalry). I think it would be hard to have the 'tups to think for themselves since they have been dependent on each other for so long, and think of themselves as a unit. As a parent, I would feel that family's needs would overshadow my family. jmo.

wendimail said...

Re: Dr. Ginott's parenting techniques:

What a lovely scenario you painted. Wouldn't we all have loved to be raised with such patience and insight. Children live what they learn.

I find it curious how often Kate is chastising Jon to "have patience" when dealing with the kids. It must be hard to have your spouse bossing you around on a regular basis. I wonder how Kate was raised?

I just have to put my 2 cents in and say I do not believe in spanking AT ALL. It isn't necessary. IMO, children need guidance and firm, consistent discipline. There are consequences to misbehaving but spanking isn't one of them. Spanking teaches nothing of value.

Having said all this; I am so glad I didn't have to raise six children all the same age.

SmartyQ said...

Mady pitched a fit outside the door to the theater because she didn't like it that it had been a surprise (?) or something ridiculous like that.
Mady was angry because Katie talked all during the movie. Because most of us know that's the way Katie operates, Mady was, IMO, justified in her frustration.

Anonymous said...

I find it funny that we believe anything posted. Then when someone says that they actually KNOW something for a fact, it gets dismissed.

They are all in the same class. They make up about 1/3 of the class.

Pam said...

Doubtful. By almost 5 they would have caught up, at least some of them would have. If the parents believed they were delayed, speech therapy and other help would have been in order,

I think the girls are doing better with their verbal skills. Boys are typically behind in verbal, ahead in motor. (Joel being the first to ride a 2-wheeler for example). But still lets give the kids some slack, they are multiples and it is a fact that multiples sometimes have their own 'language' or way of speaking. Even the Dilley boys have speech issues and they are much older. The last Dilley special I saw mentioned this specifically. And I don't hear anyone blaming Mom and Dad Dilley for it. It's just the way it is. Hopefully all the kids that need it will recieve the appropriate speech therapy.

Pam said...

Are you saying that all the tups are in the same class? I do not think that this is a good situation,
Agree with this. The tups should be split as much as possible. They should mix the sexes. Ideally I think it would be great if there were 3 classes. 2 tups per class. One boy, one girl.

Anonymous said...

Then I would have to deal with the family dynamics which would spill into the classroom. (i.e. sibling rivalry). I think it would be hard to have the 'tups to think for themselves since they have been dependent on each other for so long, and think of themselves as a unit. As a parent, I would feel that family's needs would overshadow my family. jmo.

11/16/2008 7:35 AM

I agree. During the "tups start pre school' episode Kate was already making excuses for a particular tups inappropriate behavior while in class using the justification of the tups being siblings. A tup's paper had fallen on to the floor and another tup had stepped on it. Kate said, 'would a fellow sibling step on another sibling's paper that had fallen on to the floor, definitely; would they step on the paper of a fellow class mate, probably not'. What Kate fails to recognize is the fact that even though her children are in the same class, when they enter the class room they become fellow CLASS MATES to each other. The Gosselin children need to learn to socially adapt and associate with an individual identity that is seperate from that of their sibling 'unit'

Anonymous said...

I was watching one of the beginning episodes of J&K recently. It was sad to see how much less happy both Cara and Madi have become.

Also, having now seen the "going to Hawaii" episodes, I have a question. Do any of them (parents or kids) ever say Please or Thank You?

natasha said...

".....but it is apparently not odd for someone who has only seen them on television to make blanket statements regarding how they're disciplined, how often they act up off camera, and how messed up they will be when they're adults?"

I did state in my original post that I am basing my comments and observations only about what has been a.) seen on the show, and b.) stated by Jon and Kate in interviews or speaking engagements, and I also stated that anything that goes on "behind the scenes," unless coming from the horse's mouth, is speculation. There is nothing necessarily wrong with that. Speculation comes with the territory of putting oneself or one's family out there in public for entertainment purposes. At worst, it's the tabloid culture of America. At best, it's simply interest in something that is put out there to GENERATE interest in the first place.

I wrote this post to comment on something I opined that the parents were doing. It was never my intention to criticize the children.

Dorothy Gale said...

Another of Mady's temperamental tantrums was the time they were playing dress-up in the basement and she went nuts because her costume was thrown out.

And remember the "movie night" over the summer (again in the basement). Mady becomes hysterical because of something in the movie.

The Good Housekeeping photo shoot (recently) when Mady started acting up because Kate told the little ones about the puppy without Mady's implicit permission. (Apparently Mady doesn't like surprises to be told without her permission.)

Remember Mady's special day to get her ears pierced. She screamed bloody murder, even after they were done she was crying, because she wanted to have all eyes on her. This was her shining hour.

And remember the time Mady drove Aunt Jodi nuts and kicked poor Joel. That was so cruel because they actually showed her kicking him and I felt so bad for the little guy.

Mady's behavior is inappropriate and her parents have to know what is going on. I wouldn't be surprised if Kon are simply turning a blind eye (and ear) to Mady's overdone nonsense so they shovel more freebies down their greedy never-ending pockets.

Remember, selfish parents make selfish children.

Anonymous said...

About the parent whose child is in the class with J&K 'tups and knows their behavior reports (ie. red light/yellow light).

I just wanted to add that I have worked in many classrooms where the red/yellow/green light system is very public, such as each kid having a wall chart that is up for display. The teacher will give the child a warning "Alexis you are on yellow right now..." at the end of the day the charts are on display for any parent to see.

I have also seen children come out of the classroom with a ribbon on their short, that shows what their overall behavior was for the day. When the parent comes to pick them up, they can see that their child was "green" etc.....

So it is poosibel that the anon poster DOES have a child in class with J&K's 'tups and has looked at the wall charts or ribbons/stickers that the kids get at the end of the day and has noted thier behavior.

Going throgh private records or hearing small town gossip isn;t neccessary.

ThreeFarmers said...

Regarding the tup's at-school behavior, I imagine that any poor in-class behavior is well under control by now as they have been attending school for several weeks.

That said, good behavior at school doesn't mean that we'll see good behavior on camera all the time. We all know kids will adjust to whatever boundaries are set. I've seen kids who are well behaved while at school, but who turn into little scoundrels while in the presence of their parents, and vice versa. I think we all know kids like that.

If their at-home boundaries are broader than their school limits, they will act accordingly.

Anonymous said...

Remember Mady's special day to get her ears pierced. She screamed bloody murder, even after they were done she was crying, because she wanted to have all eyes on her. This was her shining hour.
--------------------------

This was not exactly how things went. Mady did cry, as KON expected - they actually comforted her- but she did not scream bloody murder. And , she cried because she just had holes poked through her ears, not because she wanted attention.

Mady's behavior can be challenging, and I agree with you and many others that KON need to open their eyes to their very troubled child,but geez, give Mady a break. Most of her bad behavior is KON's fault.

Anonymous said...

"Even the Dilley boys have speech issues and they are much older. The last Dilley special I saw mentioned this specifically. And I don't hear anyone blaming Mom and Dad Dilley for it."

The Dilley parents also said during this special that the boys were receiving speech therapy. What is there to blame Mom and Dad Dilley for? They obviously acknowledge that their boys had a speech issue and took appropriate measures to improve their speech patterns.

Ilovemykids said...

Alexis you are on yellow right now..." at the end of the day the charts are on display for any parent to see

No, most teachers will put the charts "back" the way they were prior to the end of the school day.
At least, that's the way it worked with my children.

Addison said...

Can some one please tell me why it's called sixgosselins.com and not eightgosselins? After all, there are eight children. Why do Jon and Kate leave out Mady and Cara?

-----

I don't have an answer for this, but I have noticed it too and boy does it make me mad! Also, if you look at the "Kid's Corner" pages, you'll notice that the discriptions on the tups' pages are much more detailed than on Mady or Cara's pages. On Cara's all it says is "Hi, I'm Cara, how are you?" Compare this to the paragraph or two on Hannah's page.

Anonymous said...

Do they spank the kids?

Tam said...

Who snoops at another child's behavior chart when it is not their own child? This just seems bizarre to me. IF this person really did read a chart, leave it alone! I have my doubts they did though..

Anonymous said...

I find it funny that we believe anything posted.
.............
Believe what is posted? As in KNOW what we saw when we watched the show? I don't see anyone making stuff up here that was supposed to have happened on the show that did not really happen where we could watch it with our own 2 eyes. No, I don't believe a parent who suddenly comes out of the woodwork and claims to know the discipline issues with another child in class who is clearly not close friends with their own kid--since the poor Gosselin kids are not allowed to have friends and all.

Pam said...

Who snoops at another child's behavior chart when it is not their own child? This just seems bizarre to me. IF this person really did read a chart, leave it alone! I have my doubts they did though..
If its up on a board or wall for everyone to see, then it isnt snooping. My son's K teacher used a behavior chart that she placed on the wall. It was visable to anyone who came into the room. No one ever made an issue of it. We just considered it a behavior management tool.

Pam said...

What is there to blame Mom and Dad Dilley for?

Absolutely nothing. And there is no reason to blame the G's either. My point is that speech issues occur with multiples. No ones fault, it's just a fact.

ThreeFarmers said...

Absolutely nothing. And there is no reason to blame the G's either. My point is that speech issues occur with multiples. No ones fault, it's just a fact.

I agree that there are certain speech issues that multiples are prone to as they reinforce that diction behaviors among each other. I've often heard this to be true among multiples.

However, things like baby talk and using made up words are certainly problematic once the children reach school age. If the kids are still using baby talk by the time they are in school, that is a reflection on the parents.

Pam said...

However, things like baby talk and using made up words are certainly problematic once the children reach school age. If the kids are still using baby talk by the time they are in school, that is a reflection on the parents.

True, but I dont think the tups are using baby talk. Just wrong use of language and bad pronunciation.

Anonymous said...

I'm commenting on the mother reading another child's behavior chart at school. This is a by-product of being a celebrity. The bounds of privacy are blurred. They are on tv so "fans" believe they can access any and all private information. This is the direction J&K+8 has taken. Where is the line to be drawn? IMO the parents draw the line.

Anonymous said...

My son, not premature, had severe speech problems. At about age 3.5, he began receiving free speech therapy at his local elementary school. All I needed to do was get him there and do homework assignments. My son had to be taught correct tongue placement for each sound, pronoun usage, and irregular verb usage. The good news is that when he started kindergarten at age 5, he spoke clearly and totally age appropriate. Early intervention was the best thing I ever did for my child. Parents have to be committed to keeping to the schedule of speech therapy and doing simple play like homework assignments with the child. IMO, the sooner a child gets help, the better the outcome.

Anonymous said...

Who snoops at another child's behavior chart when it is not their own child? This just seems bizarre to me. IF this person really did read a chart, leave it alone! I have my doubts they did though..
If its up on a board or wall for everyone to see, then it isnt snooping. My son's K teacher used a behavior chart that she placed on the wall. It was visable to anyone who came into the room. No one ever made an issue of it. We just considered it a behavior management tool.

******
Fine, but if you made it a point to daily check on certain other kids in the class, and not just stick to your own child's, then there is a problem.

chives said...

I routinely checked the chart to see what the kids were doing in the class. I had a right to know how the class is doing, especially if there is a child (mine included) who is creating a distraction to others or who might even be a little dangerous. I never used to to blackball a teacher, I just wanted to know what was going on in my child's classroom.

Anonymous said...

anon 11/14 7:55--Maybe Alexis likes her own room.


Their behavior very well could have been great, but I would hope that trained teachers would NOT say otherwise on national tv

11/15/2008 6:25 AM


Trained teachers would not say otherwise on TV, just for the sake of TV. They are representing that school and not KON.

Thank you to the poster who's kids are in the class...

Please check your source. You are wrong.

My child is in their class. They are not discipline problems. They do not get reds and yellows everyday.

11/15/2008 12:16 PM


There are alot of lies and innuedos on this blog, thanks for clearing up one of them for us.

And, to all who think the kids are beaten by KON just becuase you, who posts on this blog) say "flinches", stop verbally abusing these kids. You're making something out of nothing. A spanking doesn't equal a beating. And to insinuate that KON does that is just wrong.

Anonymous said...

Addison said...
Can some one please tell me why it's called sixgosselins.com and not eightgosselins? After all, there are eight children. Why do Jon and Kate leave out Mady and Cara?

This is an error on their webmaster's design. The Url states The Gosselin Ten. Hey/she might've just forgotten to change it from the original url of the tups. I really don't think there was any intention on KON to leave out the twins.

Anonymous said...

Robin said...
I found it curious why we did not see Mady's misbehavior that caused her not to participate in the Hawaii chef class..the bad behavior is what makes the show interesting - especially Mady's...it's not a good episode without at least one Mady breakdown...

I guess the behavior must have happened in their suite..which by the way, other than showing the family check in we never saw the suite again...I bet we won't see it in the wedding finale next week either...guess the camaras aren't allowed in as many places as before...if the show only shows them in public, to me that's not a show and clear evidence of scripting and control of what we see...that's not reality, that's a play...
----------------------------------

Ive been reading here for a few weeks now and havent posted yet. I often hear that there should be more privacy for the kids and less filming and then they actually do give the kids more privacy by NOT filming in thier suite (where they dress, bathe, etc) and there are complaints. Then I hear complints that Mady's outbursts shouldnt be filmed and that its not fair to her. But now that they are filming them less its not as entertaining? It seems to me that no matter what J&K do it wont be good enough. I for one am happy that the kids had a private place to go back to and unwind and that Mady's less than perfect behavior isnt being flaunted on national tv again for all her peers to see.

Anonymous said...

"Dorothy Gale said...
Another of Mady's temperamental tantrums was the time they were playing dress-up in the basement and she went nuts because her costume was thrown out.

And remember the "movie night" over the summer (again in the basement). Mady becomes hysterical because of something in the movie.

The Good Housekeeping photo shoot (recently) when Mady started acting up because Kate told the little ones about the puppy without Mady's implicit permission. (Apparently Mady doesn't like surprises to be told without her permission.)

Remember Mady's special day to get her ears pierced. She screamed bloody murder, even after they were done she was crying, because she wanted to have all eyes on her. This was her shining hour.

And remember the time Mady drove Aunt Jodi nuts and kicked poor Joel. That was so cruel because they actually showed her kicking him and I felt so bad for the little guy.

Mady's behavior is inappropriate and her parents have to know what is going on. I wouldn't be surprised if Kon are simply turning a blind eye (and ear) to Mady's overdone nonsense so they shovel more freebies down their greedy never-ending pockets.

Remember, selfish parents make selfish children.

_________________________________


All the points you brought up I had thought of too. I remember one episode when Mady came home from school and as usual was in a bad mood and she walked up to one of the tups and smacked them on the head.

She is just like Kate with her tantrums. How many eps have we seen Kate screeching at Jon for one reason or another. How many of Kate's temper tantrums have been shown on the show? Remember the fit she had over some knob from a piece of furniture and was screaming at the top of her lungs? Or how about the time she threw the kids plastic toy down the stairs? We certainly don't need a DNA test to prove that Mady is Kate's daughter. And as the years go on I bet more than one of the kids may end up with the same temperment.

ThreeFarmers said...

You know, regarding Mady's outbursts, while we see them often enough, we usually learn the reason why she's having them from Jon and Kate's point-of-view (or spin, as it were).

Sometimes we see what is going on and understand why Mady's upset, but other times, we are sort of at the mercy of J&K's opinions, which are hardly accurate and trustworthy.

I just wonder if J&K don't sometimes give us the straight story regarding Mady. We already know that they have no problem looking into the camera and talking about her "ugliness".

Makes me wonder just what the truth is.

momforthekids said...

The show in which Kate had a fit because the knob came off, just goes to show how unstable Kate is. That show would have been good to see on The Soup. She has eight kids of course a knob is going to come off at one time or another in her life. Do you remember the scared looks on the kids faces? Kate really lost it, and that's exactly what Mady does. It's like Mady and Kate came from the same mold. Like mother, like daughter.

Anonymous said...

I don't know that we'll know the truth--- sadly Julie has decided to bail..... and Jodi isn't talking.... and Kon can't pick out the truth from a multiple choice question.

Anonymous said...

Fine, but if you made it a point to daily check on certain other kids in the class, and not just stick to your own child's, then there is a problem.
_________________________________

ITA with this. Especially to remember specifics like one tup boy getting a red twice? Weird.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
Addison said...
Can some one please tell me why it's called sixgosselins.com and not eightgosselins? After all, there are eight children. Why do Jon and Kate leave out Mady and Cara?

This is an error on their webmaster's design. The Url states The Gosselin Ten. Hey/she might've just forgotten to change it from the original url of the tups. I really don't think there was any intention on KON to leave out the twins.


A domain name has nothing to do with webmaster design. IIRC Jon created the domain while Kate was still pregnant with the tups. It's been in use for years, long before their current webmaster and TLC's involvement.

I also think it's obvious why he chose the sixgosselins over eightgosselins. It was a way for him to garner publicity (and donations) for their six new babies. Not the two they already had. It's a shame he had to number it at all though.

rosey in washington said...

Ah Ha! It seems to me like KATE (or one of per paid "people") has finally spoken on this blog! Its obvious that she is the one who wrote about her childrens behavior at school. I mean, why else would someone else who "just has a child in the same class" get SO defensive and SO angry over children that aren't even hers??

Kate, you are SO obvious. Plus, has anyone else noticed that all the posts from this "lady with a child in the same class" and ALSO the other one (anon 5:58) who is blanantly sticking up for J&K and bashing this site are ALL Anonymous???

Show your ugly face Kate, we all know you read these blogs anyway.

highondegrassi said...

"As I recall, the caretakers had only good things to say about the sextuplets' behavior.

---------------------------

Their behavior very well could have been great, but I would hope that trained teachers would NOT say otherwise on national tv."

What else would you expect to say? That they're brats? They're not going to say anything negative on national TV, so it was pointless to even ask them about the G kids behavior. If they said anything negative they would have to endure the Wrath of Kon.

Anonymous said...

addison said...
Can some one please tell me why it's called sixgosselins.com and not eightgosselins? After all, there are eight children. Why do Jon and Kate leave out Mady and Cara
_____________________________
That's an easy one. The website was set up as a way to beg for things they needed for the kids. There is an archival website that shows just how much begging was done. Most of the requests were for the tups but the begging also included payments for the twins tuition. After all, why should they use their own money knowing others will throw it at them?

The Truth Will Set You Free said...

I don't know that we'll know the truth--- sadly Julie has decided to bail

I have not decided to "bail". My concerns for the children are the same as they have always been. The truth is out there. Everyone sees what's going on from what they air on the show and most of the speculation on here is very perceptive and accurate.

The truth really doesn't matter. TLC/Figure 8 is doing their job. It's a business and they don't care how the kids are treated or what damage is being caused by what is aired. As long as the viewers are there, they will continue. It's nothing more than ratings to them. They don't love the children or even care about the family. It's only about MONEY!

Unfortunately, the fans of the show don't care about the truth either. It amazes me that people think Jon and Kate's interactions are funny and entertaining. Watching parents belittle their children, break their spirits, use them to bring in ratings isn't funny or entertaining to me. Using kids for the "shock value" is wrong. Showing their private moments to get people to talk is wrong. Will Jon finally stand up to Kate? What will Kate do/say next? Seeing a mother out of control and watching a real family being destroyed by greed is not entertaining to me. The whole thing is disgusting and it makes me sick!

Then we have the media constantly trying to make us believe their relationship is what a typical marriage looks like. They are America's favorite family. Kate is supermom, "how does she do it"?

My opinion is not based on speculation or 22 mins of a TV show. I am a loving mother who can't stand what is happening to the children. It has nothing to do with jealousy or hate. I have life experiences to draw upon and I know that damage is being done and the future for the children isn't going to be easy. The show is wrong in so many ways.

Honestly, this entire show and it's popularity tells alot about our society and how messed up it really is. Teenage/college aged girls love this show and it's scary to think that they would see Kate as a role model. Young mothers are overwhelmed and see Kate acting the way she does and it makes them feel better about themselves. It lowers the bar of what is acceptable behavior. I've read people say they love Kate because she says things to Jon that they wish they could say to their own husbands. What is wrong with this picture?

Most of the problems in our society stem from a breakdown at home. If what we are witnessing on the show is typical behavior of a normal American family, then no wonder we have the problems that we do in our society.

Until society as a whole steps up and says this isn't acceptable-- we are not going to watch--it will continue. But there is no doubt in my mind that we will all be paying for it in the future.

Anonymous said...

My son, not premature, had severe speech problems. At about age 3.5, he began receiving free speech therapy at his local elementary school. All I needed to do was get him there and do homework assignments. My son had to be taught correct tongue placement for each sound, pronoun usage, and irregular verb usage. The good news is that when he started kindergarten at age 5, he spoke clearly and totally age appropriate. Early intervention was the best thing I ever did for my child. Parents have to be committed to keeping to the schedule of speech therapy and doing simple play like homework assignments with the child. IMO, the sooner a child gets help, the better the outcome.
--------------
I know many parents who either use early intervention or at least worry ahead of time and wonder if their child should get it. KON just thinks it's cute when they talk baby talk and also it keeps them babyish longer so they can ride the gravy train longer. Look at how Alexis and her cute baby talk are pointed out. Check out their website even. They post letters supposedly by fans saying how cute it is and her bio even says I yike Dusty. Him is cute. Almost 5 year olds DO NOT talk like that normally. To the person who said they don't talk baby talk, have you been around kids of this age with normal speech?

Anonymous said...

I just wanted to say, about that episode where Mady threw a fit on movie night..she was very upset because a monkey got eaten in the film. I personally find Mady and her behavior hard to take and I wish they'd just leave her out of the show. But, that night, she showed she has real heart.

DirtyDisher

Onomatopoeia said...

Dang...

All this time I've been thinking that the discipline problems were the result of low blood sugar...

I still say the whole family needs an intervention...Dr. Phil? Bueller?? Anyone???

Anonymous said...

"Until society as a whole steps up and says this isn't acceptable-- we are not going to watch--it will continue. But there is no doubt in my mind that we will all be paying for it in the future."

===================================

AMEN Julie. Kate and Jon are ridiculous and those who are unfortunate to meet these people are the only ones who really get their evil ways. I have a loving relationship with my husband and would never ever shout at him or belittle him like she does, nor would he act or treat me the way he does Kate or the children. It is ridiculous that there are people who follow them like they are "GOD." Open up your eyes AND minds people and see them for what they really are. SELFISH UNCARING Parents of eight beautiful children. They are making money off of YOU and their children. UGH!

momforthekids said...

the truth will set you free,

EVERYTHING that you have said makes complete sense to those of us with a soul. Kate and Jon Gosselin have no soul. They don't care about those children and neither does TLC. It's all about the money. How sad that those little children have to be the ones to suffer. Parents are suppose to protect their children, but Kate and Jon Gosselin don't. How could anyone enjoy their show when they can see what damage is being done to the children. It's very obvious why Kate and Jon have no friends or family.

Anonymous said...

It's so nice to hear from you Julie. Your post says it all. Hope Jodi is doing OK. I stopped watching the show but I will never forget the episode where she took care of all those sick children. I don't think there are many people like her that would have had the patience to give all of them the special attention they definitely needed.

Anonymous said...

"Kate and Jon Gosselin have no soul."

==================================

People without souls or a conscience could care less about other's feelings, even their own children. The Gosselins are a prime example of this thing the rest of us call GREED.

I guarantee they WILL care when their show stops and the money stops rolling in.... BUT maybe I am the naive one, perhaps it is too late for this and they will never see their "ways" but either way in the end, they will get theirs.

wendimail said...

"Anonymous Anonymous said...

I just wanted to say, about that episode where Mady threw a fit on movie night..she was very upset because a monkey got eaten in the film. I personally find Mady and her behavior hard to take and I wish they'd just leave her out of the show. But, that night, she showed she has real heart.

DirtyDisher

11/17/2008 9:20 AM"

And, if you remember, she was encouraged and joined by Kate in flaming this drama queen behavior! OMG, one of the kids was eating another of the kids! Kate - GROW UP.

Janine said...

Anonymous said...
I really don't care what you believe or not. I will NOT let people pass of wrong information as fact. Sorry.

I know because I unlike you, are around them three days a week for school. I am there, you are not.

Why haven't I "come forward before?"...because I don't wish to post personal information about them. I only did this time because it was a totally untrue thing being printed about their children.

You can attack the parents all you want, but I won't be silent when you print things about the kids that are simply not true.

11/15/2008 9:43 PM


Thank you!!! You are truly an advocate of the children. Not the posers who rip on their mom.

I am glad that the kids are in your child's class.

Anonymous said...

"ITA with this. Especially to remember specifics like one tup boy getting a red twice? Weird."

I never mentioned who had a red twice. It is not posted on a chart.

I don't have an exact ticker count of who had yellow and who didn't.

I posted because someone on here was posting that the tups get red and yellow everyday. That is simply not true. ONE of them had red twice. Twice is no where near everyday.

Since we are into the school year now, they are all in the green.

Anonymous said...

I am not kate, I'm not paid by Kate. I've never even had a conversation with Kate. I do have a child in the class.

I am not angry, I'm upset that someone would post something that is flat out not true about the children.

They have enough personal stuff for the world see, they don't need people posting that they are "bad kids in school"....They are not.

I don't care if you believe it or not. When I see something that is not true about the kids I will post about it.

I would think that many of you would be relieved to hear that they are doing well in school. That they are happy and adjusting well to school.

I guess not.

Anonymous said...

Honestly, this entire show and it's popularity tells alot about our society and how messed up it really is. Teenage/college aged girls love this show and it's scary to think that they would see Kate as a role model.
-------
My teenager continues to say she doesn't want to get married because of this show. A bit dramatic, I know. But whenever we are switching channels and see the show she says this. She can't stand that awful couple.

Anonymous said...

Aony @ 11/15 12:15am said: "The fact that the children don't question going to time out, don't bawk at it or cry tells me something is wrong. Why are they so robotic about something other children protest? Is there something else going on that we don't see?"

It used to bother me when the tups were much younger and they would robotically march up the steps for their naps and then stay upstairs so 'well manneredly' until Kate told them they could come back down. I've never seen children go so readily to their naps and stay there till Mom went to get them (when they are old enuf to move around the house on their own). Unless kids have changed from when I had toddlers, I'm used to them protesting naps and getting up at random when they were done.

Just something else to scratch my head about and question J&K about. Lots of irregularities in their child rearing practices and experiences.

Anonymous said...

The post by Julie was very informative. I think one of the reasons why everyone keeps building up Kon is because that's what our society does. We love to build people up, regardless of the truth because that makes the story that much more interesting and marketable. But in the same regard as a society we also love to see people fall and when Kon does come tumbling down (soon perhaps) I can only imagine that that is when their devoted following will finally see and believe the truth.

Anonymous said...

The problem with discipline in that household is threefold.

One, Jon and Kate are both poor role models. "Do as I say, not as I do" works only when kids are old enough to comprehend the irony. Right now, the kids are getting mixed messages between how their parents act and how they expect the kids to act.

Two, we don't know how much hands-on parenting Jon and Kate do, but we can guess that between the show, endorsements and speaking engagements, the kids are parented by proxy most of the time. And quite likely, the goal of the parenting is not preparing the kids for life, but rather, preparing them for their roles on the show.

Last, I don't think we can really judge with accuracy from what we see on the show. Just because Kate says Mady was left out of the cookie baking because she had a tantrum, for all we know she had a tummy ache and the tantrum thing was a fabrication designed to pander to the "interactive" viewers who want to see Mady held accountable for her behavior. The show is edited to make things look like the want them to look, not necessarily like they are. This "reality" show is very far from reality.

Anonymous said...

This is merely speculation on my part, but I think once the show is cancelled, if Jon and Kate are not able to make a living by marketing themselves as spokespeople (as they are trying to now), they will try to get the kids into acting/modeling. I recall in an earlier episode Kate saying that if they lived closer to NYC she would pursue acting/modeling with the twins.

tripletsmom said...

My heart goes out to Julie and Jodi. I know the pain that they must feel to see what is happening in the children's lives. I think that the "fans" are just blind to what is happening and that they just DON'T want to admit the TRUTH. Anyone with eyes can see that these children are being exploited. Mady is the one that I really worry about. She needs help.

Anonymous said...

Comment on Julie's post:
AMEN!! There's no way I could have said it better..

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
Honestly, this entire show and it's popularity tells alot about our society and how messed up it really is. Teenage/college aged girls love this show and it's scary to think that they would see Kate as a role model.

I agree. The whole J & K + 8 reality show reminds me of two kids playing house. Alot of fantasy role playing; right down to Kate dressing up her 'baby dolls' and their Hawaii vow re newal ceremony to J & K's new 'Barbie' dream house.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
"I have actually been impressed with the discipline Jon and Kate have been using on their children. I am a pre-school teacher and I can say from experience that the Gosselin children behave much better than most children their age."

How can you be impressed with J & J&K's discipline when the discipline viewers are seeing obviously is NOT working. Episode after episode the tups have been repeatedly reminded and reprimanded for inappropriate behavior and the inappropriate behavior still exists as common place in their home, specifically the constant hitting of each other. Kate even made some lame attempt on their website discussing the 'Golden Rule' using a children's book as a reference of example. An example that to Kate, must only be appealing in 'kid friendly' story book form as it is obviously not one that is actually being applied with any sense of routine or consistency in their home!!

Anonymous said...

I would bet money that when the show goes off the air Kate will try to get the kids into acting or modeling. If nothing else, Kate is pretty slick when it comes to finding opportunities to exploit her family to make money or get freebies. She will find some way to keep the gravy train going. Just look at her history, she starts out a young single woman, then turns herself almost instantly into a mother of eight, who has people supporting and taking care of them, then wrangles her own tv show. Yep, I'm sure she has a plan B.

Anonymous said...

It used to bother me when the tups were much younger and they would robotically march up the steps for their naps and then stay upstairs so 'well manneredly' until Kate told them they could come back down. I've never seen children go so readily to their naps and stay there till Mom went to get them (when they are old enuf to move around the house on their own). Unless kids have changed from when I had toddlers, I'm used to them protesting naps and getting up at random when they were done.
---------------------------

Kate had a locked gate on the doorway - thd kids had no choice but to stay upstairs.

I also noticed in a few episodes that there was a doorknob cover on the INSIDE of the door to the basement, basically showing that if the kids are downstairs, Kate can keep them down there with the door shut.

Ravello said...

Julie, thanks for a great comment. Your insight is valuable to anyone trying to understand the KON mess.
My warmest regards to you, Jodi and your families.
Luv Aunt Jodi.

Megan said...

I agree with other posters that the Gosselins are not consistent with their punishments and I think that is a huge downfall of their parenting (among MANY other things). I understand they have 8 children and that it is hard to watch all of them but they have TONS of help so even if it goes as far as a simple, “we do not hit, now apologize,” every time it happens then eventually the kids will learn or at least gain a knowledge that it’s not nice. It seems at teams that they perpetuate the bad behavior! Remember at the doctors when a girl smacked one of the boys and John said that it wasn’t that hard? That child should have been reprimanded for the action, not yell at the boy to man up IMO.
Or remember in the last episode when Cara had a meltdown because all of the children wanted her cookies and not Mady’s? Kate ended up not letting the rest of the children choose, gave them Mady’s cookies, and let Cara pout with her tray full of cookies. Now is it just me or if that behavior had been with Mady, she would have been scolded and told to share, but Cara gets away with the meltdown. This seemed like it would have been a good opportunity to teach a life lesson to Cara but nothing happens, it seems like it is showing the younger kids that if you act up then things go your way, or at the very least that you don’t have to share.
I do not have children of my own but I teach middle school and I noticed that most of the bad behavior often comes from students who just want some attention, granted some are just bad! I think in Mady’s behavior, and obviously from what we’ve seen, she just wants some attention from her parents. It seems that even the littlest positive reinforcement brightens her day and makes her smile. I wish KON would see this and pay more attention to her, or give her some more encouragement. Perhaps this would cut down on all of the “low blood sugar” moments. I’m sure it is also hard to treat all of the children equal 100% of the time, but if KON wouldn’t be so noticeable with their favorites then perhaps that could also help with the outbursts and bad behavior. Just my two cents…or whatever it is worth.

Anonymous said...

Julie-

I know I echo many others when I say this :

Thank you for all you are trying to do for the kids, thank you for protecting Aunt Jodi, who we all came to love as a result of her being on the show, and thank you for still being involved as much as you can be.

Your post was very thought-provoking, and for you, must have been very painful.

I hope somebody, somewhere (TLC? Figure 8? Kate? Jon?) does something to end this show, and soon.

SkippyMom said...

I was relating the story about the boy tup hitting his head and Kate admonishing him that "God punished you for not listening."

Do you know what my husband said?

"You do know what TLC stands for don't you?"

"Try LOOKING Christian" or as much as they get from the show isn't TLC actually "Their Living Christ"?

They don't worship a christian god, do they? Because I find it hard to believe anyone who does would threaten their child in this manner.

I think my husband nailed it.

Diane said...

Anonymous 11/17 2:46pm said..
Kate had a locked gate on the doorway - thd kids had no choice but to stay upstairs.

I also noticed in a few episodes that there was a doorknob cover on the INSIDE of the door to the basement, basically showing that if the kids are downstairs, Kate can keep them down there with the door shut.


What is wrong with that? So, she doesn't want the kids waking up and running downstairs when she and Jon are sleeping. I do the same with my kids! I don't want anybody to get hurt.

Anonymous said...

What is wrong with that? So, she doesn't want the kids waking up and running downstairs when she and Jon are sleeping. I do the same with my kids! I don't want anybody to get hurt.
-----------------------------

I was responding to the comment about how the kids stay upstairs until they are told to come down. They can't come downstairs because they are locked behind a gate.

And, I am quite certain that you do not keep your kids locked in their rooms while you are sleeping in until 8:30 because you "are not a morning person". I understand the safety issue , and for anyone else but Kate, it's valid.

Also, the doorknob cover on the inside of the basement door is unacceptable- like keeping an animal in a cage. JMO though....

Ilovemykids said...

So, she doesn't want the kids waking up and running downstairs when she and Jon are sleeping.

Um, excuse me, but both parents should never be asleep when young children are awake.

Anonymous said...

Ilovemykids said...

So, she doesn't want the kids waking up and running downstairs when she and Jon are sleeping.

Um, excuse me, but both parents should never be asleep when young children are awake.

In my state it's against the law to lock children in a room. It's unsafe in case of fire for one reason. When I had a wandering little one I had an alarm that I set when I closed the door to the room and it would go off if he opened the door. Much safer and more humane.

UniStudent said...

To the poster who is saying that the Gosselins should go on Dr. Phil... They already were on Dr. Phil!

While on a personal level I don't always agree with Dr. Phil and his show, the Gosselins were given many more advantages than anyone could imagine. They were given nannies 3 days a week for 6 months. They had one on one parenting classes!

Despite the fact that someone reached out to them and provided them with professional help, they truly learned nothing. These people were given every oppourtunity to do right by their children, but they chose to go down a destructive path.

There is no excuse for them anymore to not be able to handle their children. They cannot handle their children because "The life is their show and the show is their life". I don't think that they don't love their children, but I do think everyday they make choices that are not putting their childrens best interests first.

PS Here is the Dr Phil link
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_yAohOt1eI

Anonymous said...

Dr Phil also gave them an amazing amount of toys, also. Did I read that they sold some of these toys, as they don't have room to organize anything with so many toys to dig through?

Granny said...

Anonymous said...
Kate pacifies Mady all the time. If you knew that your bad behavior would get attention from your mother, attention that caters to what you want why wouldn't a child keep it up

I don't think Kate has any idea how to handle Mady's blurts. Mady is a bright child who is not willing to be bribed or manipulated into doing things. I've seen Kate try different tactics on Mady and haven't seen any of them work on her. I hope Mady can get the help and attention she desperately needs in order to work these issues out. She needs some divine intervention because Kate has now gone to shunning the child from family activities which in my opinion is only going to further Mady's resentments. Just my opinion though based on what little I've seen with the show, it's hard to know the whole story with these folks when we only get our info. from the show or from the few who post that know this family.

Granny said...

Mom to five little sunflowers said: I have been a quiet reader of your site and wanted to comment ont he discipline thread. While every parent does parent differently, as well as discipline, I still feel there are plenty of postive opportunities to discipline consistently even while the cameras are rolling or not. I know certain behaviors certainly call for unique measures, but all children need the ability to realize consequences and age appropriate one's at that. I agree with your statement about consistency. I feel if they find a method that is comfortable for them, they should be able to utilize it whether the cameras are on or not.

They also can take the child out of view of the camera's into another room and shut the door to keep the discipline consistent. Jon and kate can refuse the camera's access to that part of discipline if need be.

Granny said...

The Truth will set you free said: don't know that we'll know the truth--- sadly Julie has decided to bail

I have not decided to "bail". My concerns for the children are the same as they have always been. The truth is out there. Everyone sees what's going on from what they air on the show and most of the speculation on here is very perceptive and accurate.

The truth really doesn't matter. TLC/Figure 8 is doing their job. It's a business and they don't care how the kids are treated or what damage is being caused by what is aired. As long as the viewers are there, they will continue. It's nothing more than ratings to them. They don't love the children or even care about the family. It's only about MONEY!

Unfortunately, the fans of the show don't care about the truth either. It amazes me that people think Jon and Kate's interactions are funny and entertaining. Watching parents belittle their children, break their spirits, use them to bring in ratings isn't funny or entertaining to me. Using kids for the "shock value" is wrong. Showing their private moments to get people to talk is wrong. Will Jon finally stand up to Kate? What will Kate do/say next? Seeing a mother out of control and watching a real family being destroyed by greed is not entertaining to me. The whole thing is disgusting and it makes me sick!

Right on Julie, you keep speaking up for those kids! They need your voice. I know you are in a very hard spot with not wanting to cross lines for Jodie's sake and the sake of her family and wanting to speak up on behalf of the kids. I've been there myself in a situation that occured in my own family and it's a difficult place to be in but just want you to know, I think you've done a great job in handling it all and to say, Keep up the good work. I am a firm believer that the truth always comes out victorious over lies, I've seen it many times in my own life. God Bless your family!

sharpmom4 said...

I was just wondering is Julie Jodi's sister?