An Open Letter to Jon

Published for Cassandra

Aren't you ashamed? Aren't you embarrassed?

I will be going to the Outer Banks with my family next month. I too will be staying in Corolla... in a house with 5 bedrooms, 5.5 bathrooms, and a pool. However, there will be many differences from your stay at the Outer Banks.

We will be 5 adults and 1 baby. Our house is right ON the beach... no block and a half walk.

We will be PAYING for the house and gas and food and activities ourselves.

There will be NO cameras in our faces.

We will have total PRIVACY.

Aren't you ashamed? Aren't you embarrassed?

We have EARNED this vacation. My husband WORKED until he was 80 years old. He never made a lot of money, but we lived frugally. He never sat in front of a computer in the closet and cruised the internet. My kids never went to Disney World. We've put 4 kids through college -- one at the age of 32, so we also helped support his wife and children.

I don't believe how you go on and on about "we decided to...." or "Jenny is our helper"... or "we decided to look at property that I had researched on the internet." You're a grown man. Shouldn't you be supporting your family? Instead of supporting your family, you are making fun of your children and backing up the insanity that your wife insists on perpetuating.

I don't understand how you have no shame or embarrassment about all the perks you are receiving by letting people photograph your children... in the most intimate moments of their lives.

Aren't you ashamed? Aren't you embarrassed?

146 comments:

beachluvin said...

Nice post, I totally agree but I would have addressed it to both Jon and Kate, they should both be ashamed of themselves. Thank goodness you will not be at the beach at the same time as Kate Gosselin, at least you will have peace and quiet without her yelling and barking orders at JOOOOOONNNNNNN!!!

Anonymous said...

Good Post!
He will be reading this one!

Shannon said...

This is a great letter. I just wish that Jon would see how true it is and try to get back to a normal REAL life. When these kids are older and see how all thses people wanted to help them and wanted things to be different for them, theres no question it will make them feel different about there parents.

Indy mom of 3 said...

iloveeyore,

I hope you and your family have the best time! It sounds wonderful. My husband and I are living the same way, frugally thinking of college funds rather than a fine fancy house. We have been blessed by people giving us things, hand me downs. Clothes for the kids, rusted out cars to get to work...We donate what still has life in it when we are finished.

I agree Jon needs a backbone and to grow up. What are those kids going to think when they are old enough to watch their parents mocking them and realize it's not funny. Heaven help anyone who talked about one of my kids like that. Home is supposed to be a safe haven. Something the Gosselin kids will never know.

Anonymous said...

Yes, iluveeyore, Jon-boy should be ashamed and embarrassed. Clearly. That's how someone in our world of standards, expectations, and do-the-right-thing should feel in this case. However, Jon-boy is not of our world and these things simply do not apply. He has no integrity, class, ambition, brains, manners, or talents. The only thing he seems to do reasonably well is sit on his can in the closet and play "IT analyst" or "web developer" depending on his mood. Then when he gets tired of that, he reads blogs and press accounts and sends mean and intimidating emails (using atrocious grammar and misspellings) to people who question the legitimacy of the "family business." So, why would he be "ashamed" and "embarrassed?" He's a loser.

annabandana said...

Thank you for this letter to Jon. I think you have addressed it to the right person. He DOES know better. He DOES know this is wrong. I believe deep down, he IS embarrassed and ashamed.

He is the one who can change the situation. I don't think Kate is capable of change.

Let's hope he reads this and it makes him think. Hard.

Have a great trip, YOU deserve it!

Anonymous said...

My daughter, her husband and their kids are also renting one of those beachfront huge houses next week, as they do each year.
But, Jon...one difference. She is married to a doctor, who had 10 years of college and now supports his family.
No cameras, no freebies, no gifts, no begging. Just hard work.

BEE said...

I do agree that there should not be any nudity shown and that the children should not be filmed going to the bathroom or in shower. For that I think that Jon and Kate should be ashamed.

However, I don't think that they should be ashamed of accepting any of the freebies or perks. That is just all part of the deal.

Jon, Kate and the children are all working and supporting the family. It isn't just about being in front of a camera, there is a whole business aspect to it.

There absolutely should be laws for children working in reality shows. They absolutely should be paid or have separate accounts etc. It would be interesting to really know if anything like that exists for the kids.

adri said...

I would love for them to realize how foolish they've looked & change things. I would actually begin to respect them if they treated the kids more fairly (especially poor Joel)& each other, and were honest about the help & the freebies & the money.

I won't hold my breath though. I see the Viking winning a Superbowl before J&K turn a new leaf.

Anonymous said...

I don't see the Vikings winning a Super Bowl in the future. Maybe if Favre would have been allowed to be traded there. HA!

Travis said...

BEE said...

Jon, Kate and the children are all working and supporting the family. It isn't just about being in front of a camera, there is a whole business aspect to it.

Do you honestly think any of those children agreed to "working and supporting the family"? Last time I checked, that was the parents' responsibility.

Also, when the freebies were for the children, I had less of a problem with it. It was the hair plugs, Banana Republic shopping trip, teeth
whitening and countless other things the parents should be ashamed of taking that have nothing to do with their children or the original premise of the show. It's really gotten to be Jon & Kate minus 8.

Anonymous said...

Not all work involves time cards. Jon does work, and works hard. He works taking care of the children and managing the product that his family has become. I can understand being critical of turning a family into a product, but that isn't about not working. Kate works too.

And why such disdain for having a computer in a closet? Sheesh. If he took up any real space for himself, he'd be criticized for that.

mom22 said...

Bee - I totally agree with you. I saved money for 2 years and went to Corolla this June for 2 weeks it fantastic.
Jon & Kate have a different opportunity then the rest of us. Yes their decisions may not be the same ones most us would make but we should not judge them. It's a biz and they are doing quite well. yes the cameras and the nudity is strange and I think inappropriate I would not allow my 2 kids to do it but again their decisions. As far as children with the cameras there all the time - there are plenty of child stars who are just fine. Scott Baio - Ricky Schoerder and I'm too tired to think of others. I know I'm probably a very unpopular commenter but I had to say it - I think you are all going too far with this open letter.

Jennifer said...

I hope Jon reads this with an open heart. I think he knows better, and might have the capacity for shame and embarassment. I don't see Jon as the narcissist or borderline that Kate is. He might not be a genius, but he's no dummy, and I think deep down somewhere he might get it. She doesn't.

Manda said...

When life hands you lemons, you make lemonade.

You don't exploit those lemons, 6 children you happened to get at one time, just so you can afford to hire someone else to make organic lemonade for you.

BEE said...

I agree that the children have not agreed to the cameras in their home. However, they are by far not the only children in our country that help support thier families. Go to any family that has a working farm, go to an Amish farm, to a family pizza shop or a family grocery store, there are tons of kids working to help support their families.

Anonymous said...

Most of us agree J & K need to get back to basics, however, I feel the initial comment was a bit meanspirited and over the top.

Anonymous said...

It's a biz and they are doing quite well. yes the cameras and the nudity is strange and I think inappropriate I would not allow my 2 kids to do it but again their decisions.

I must respectfully disagree. Just because you are a parent doesn't mean you should be allowed to make harmful decisions for your kids. You don't own them in the sense that you are permitted to exploit or misuse them. They are not property.

I don't think the law has caught up with reality shows -- but even without a legal restriction, parents should know better than to rob their children of their privacy and childhood.

beachluvin said...

anonymous said:
"He works taking care of the children and managing the product that his family has become."

That's a downright shame that his family has become a product that has to be managed. I suppose Jon's responsibilities include marketing said product to the highest bidder, you know sort of like a pimp does.

Laura said...

Thank you for the outstanding contribution to GWoP.

Integrity matters!

Anonymous said...

BEE said...
I agree that the children have not agreed to the cameras in their home. However, they are by far not the only children in our country that help support thier families. Go to any family that has a working farm, go to an Amish farm, to a family pizza shop or a family grocery store, there are tons of kids working to help support their families.
___
There is no comparison here. The kids who work in the pizza shop, on the Amish farm, or family grocery store are helping support the family business - THEY themselves are not the family business. Huge difference.

Chris said...

Mom22 - Scott Baio and Ricky Schroeder had child labor laws protecting them. The Gosselins kids do not. And Scott Baio is a bad example. He has emotional issues and relationship/abandonment/rejection issues he's discussed (he's talked about them on his reality show and in interviews) that he's said has stemmed from being a child actor.

Just because a child actor didn't throw his life away to drugs or alcohol and may "look" fine on the outside, doesn't mean he's all together on the inside. Scott Baio is a perfect example.

mlou said...

RE:I agree that the children have not agreed to the cameras in their home. However, they are by far not the only children in our country that help support thier families. Go to any family that has a working farm, go to an Amish farm, to a family pizza shop or a family grocery store, there are tons of kids working to help support their families.

In the situations you are referring to the kids are being taught that you have to be a team player and work for what you have.
In alot of cases, these children will inherit the businesses.

These children do not have their private moments filmed for all the world to see. They are not taunted by their own parents for every little fault they may have. Family businesses are usually worked for not handed to them because of the children.

Anonymous said...

there are plenty of child stars who are just fine. Scott Baio -
ROTFLMAO. Yeah, he's a fine example of good mental health. And I don't recall him having his life lived in front of a camera and his parents mocking him. I remember him acting in a TV show. I'm sure Kate would love her kids to be the next Britney, Baio, Donny and Marie but until and unless they become actors they are being exploited for the parents greed and having their childhood robbed and Figure 8 and TLC are just as gross and revolting for allowing it to begin with and continuing it. They all are vile. Here we protest the exploitation of children in third world countries yet sit on on couches and grin at the little Gosselin with his butt crack being show to the world. And snigger at Jon calling Joel a girl. Blerggggg.
Lord love a duck

sabrinasmom said...

you know sort of like a pimp does

I am laughing so hard - that line got me banned from TWOP.

The Beach episode is on right now and I realized, for someone claiming to be "Christian", Kate sure does take the Lord's name is vain a lot.

Seti said...

Meh. While I appreciate the sentiment here, this post seems a bit overblown. The refrain sends it over the edge. Forced rhetoric. Forced poetry.

Perhaps my problem with this post is it represents a serious generational divide . All right, Jon and Kate are riding a gravy train and their behaviors and attitudes are beyond ridiculous. We all get that. Most of us have agreed that we aren't and wouldn't do a show like theirs if given the chance--integrity, character etc.

I don't know. I guess I hear this often enough--speeches from my mother about how much harder the older generations had it and how much more they were able to accomplish with a lot less money and education. While we could all use to simplify our lives, we don't live in the same world as our parents or grandparents (for those of us in our 20s and 30s especially).

You wrote:
"We have EARNED this vacation. My husband WORKED until he was 80 years old. He never made a lot of money, but we lived frugally. He never sat in front of a computer in the closet and cruised the internet."

1. Our jobs require us to be able to use the internet. It's not a sign of laziness or weakness for crying out loud.

As for this "We" business...

2. Marriage is not a guarantee; if anything, divorce seems to be a more likely conclusion. Therefore, many of us have to live on single person or single parent wages. It is the responsibility of both parents (not just Jon) to provide for the financial future of that family. Most young women would be ashamed to refer to their husbands' accomplishments as an extension of their own. But again, it's a different time.

3. These days, you need a college degree just to get by (yes yes, unless you're Kon). One set of grandparents of mine went to college and were very well off. The other set finished junior high and were fine. College educated doesn't mean as much in this flooded market.

I could go on...just a reminder to the older set not to calculate the worth of the younger set with a rusty slide rule.

mom22 said...

OK OK so Scott Baio was a bad example I said I was tired. I forgot about the whole 40 and single vh1 stint. And as far as child labor laws I have read that here a few times. They are not expected to learn lines / sit in make-up chairs / rehearse scenes. They are themselves with a camera crew living in their house. And yes we sit on our couch and watch them but realty tv or scripted tv which more like it is not going anywhere so I guess everyone should plan continuing to be appalled. Scripted tv being put in situations by the producers but the reactions are real that's the difference as I understand it. So that would be the free vacations / sesame place / train museum / shopping excursions etc. I just think this post was overboard and I agree that Jon's job is managing his family as say the Von Troppes or the real Partridges also did.

ThreeFarmers said...

Maybe Jon should stop "managing" the children and start "parenting" them.

Anonymous said...

While I agree that much needs to change in that household, I'm confused as to why people think Jon needs to get a job. That seems a little sexist and old-fashioned. Why doesn't Kate get a job? After all, Jon seems to be doing the brunt of the childcare, save for Jenny. Kate seems to be the business minded one of the two of them. Maybe life would be better all the way around if she left the house during the day, and Jon and the kids could be alone together.

Chela said...

Thank you for your post! Jon is AS responsible for this fiasco if not MORE than Kate. Everyone always seems to focus on Kate and give Jon a pass because he is not as dillusional. On the contrary! That is precisely why he should be held more accountable. He can clearly see what the issues are, BUT he is too lazy, too complacent to do anything about it.
Just as there are some things men CAN do as well as women, such as child rearing, housework,cooking, etc, GENERALLY(not always) most women tend to do the bulk of these things and do some of them better.
Although I know how un"PC" this may sound, or unenlightened, the bottom line is that Jon is the father, the MAN. There are some things that I believe fall onto the man's shoulders. One is bearing the brunt of the financial responsibility if it has been determined that it is in the best interest of the family for the mother to stay at home.
In other words, JON,grow up. Be a man. Be a father. Be a real husband. You and your family deserve it.

Anonymous said...

They are getting paid to do the show of course there are special bonuses for that...and to all people who say that they would never do the show..take a step back and see how much money you would make and how you could use the money to put your children through college without loans, even graduate school...all the things they get for free, even kate has said if they had to pay for it they would not do it, because their money is going towards their children...just a thought

Anonymous said...

They do read it.

Chris said...

mom22 -

If you've read the posts here by people who know the family (Julie) she has said that this show is far from reality TV and alot of what you see IS scripted. Also, if you've read this blog and TWOP, some were pointing out how certain scenes were shot once, twice, etc. The zoo trip comes to mind of an episode that had to be reshot twice. That's reality TV? That sounds more like acting to some or forced to act in a situation that wouldn't have been there if this wasn't a TV show.

And child labor laws protect children from being on camera more than a few hours a day. These kids are on camera more than a few hours a day regardless of how you perceive it being free vacations, amusement parks, WHATEVER. They are still being filmed for more than the allotted time all child actors are allowed to be filmed under the laws protecting children. These children have no laws because of the umbrella of it being a reality TV show and in the State of PA there are no reality TV laws protecting these children.

And again, the Von Troppes and the Partridge Family had to abide by child labor laws because there were child actors that were in those families.

If you're saying that Jon manages this family but it's just a show where the kids are being filmed having fun, well why would he need to manage them? Managing or being a manager of your children's (acting) career is a job right? Then you've proved the point that alot are trying to make - these kids are acting. Acting equals a job. Laws need to be in place to protect these children from the obvious job they're working every week.

And I disagree. Jon doesn't need to manage these children. He needs to get a job. A real job. Working FOR his family every day, instead of his kids working FOR HIM!

5monkeys said...

Jon does work, and works hard. He works taking care of the children and managing the product that his family has become. I can understand being critical of turning a family into a product, but that isn't about not working. Kate works too.

Jon works? What does he do? From my perspective, his job is to be Kate's whipping boy and nothing more. Will he ever stand up for himself and tell her to STFU already?

Kate works too? Is exploiting your children a "job"?

They both disgust me! Those kids are their "trophies", and they use them to better their own lives. Although I can't see how their lives are good. I do not envy them, and I would never subject my children to what J&K do.

5monkeys said...

Jon will never get a job because he is lazy, and has no ambition whatsoever.

Him and Kate are perfectly content letting their kids' popularity pay their bills, while they sit back and enjoy the free clothes, vacations, and other endless "perks".

Anonymous said...

and to all people who say that they would never do the show..take a step back and see how much money you would make and how you could use the money to put your children through college without loans, even graduate school...all the things they get for free, even kate has said if they had to pay for it they would not do it, because their money is going towards their children

But isn't that the point? Most of us would appreciate having extra $$ for those extras. And in fact, we all can conceive of lots of ways to make money -- that are wrong and we don't do them. Robbing a bank - and getting away with it - may in fact make you a lot richer, but we know that stealing is wrong.

Stealing a childhood is still stealing. It makes them richer, but it's still wrong.

Anonymous said...

My guess is Jon will read this and the author will get an email saying "He does the best I can."

I wonder if Kate shouldn't go back to work. She would probably have more career potential as a nurse than Jon does at, well, whatever it is he does.

ThreeFarmers said...

My guess is Jon will read this and the author will get an email saying "He does the best I can."


I nominate this for comment of the week! *snicker*

Anonymous said...

I often wondered why Kate quit working in the first place. She doesn't seem very happy at home, and she certainly isn't a hands-on parent. Perhaps working outside the home would be good for her.

Anonymous said...

If Jon's "job" is managing the product his family has become, that makes his children commodities whose lives are up for auction to the highest bidder. But they're not actors and therefore have none of the protections afforded to child actors. Remember Macaulay Culkin, whose father, Kit, managed his career? When his mother sued Kit for custody claiming he had mismanaged Kit's career, which turned into an ugly battle for control over the money Macaulay had earned, Macaulay, at the age of 14, took his parents to court to gain control over his earnings -- and he won! What remedies will be available to the Gosselin children when they're old enough to understand the extent to which their parents profited by selling out their lives?

Samantha said...

I agree that the children have not agreed to the cameras in their home. However, they are by far not the only children in our country that help support thier families. Go to any family that has a working farm, go to an Amish farm, to a family pizza shop or a family grocery store, there are tons of kids working to help support their families



That is very true, but i dont see the girl at the pizza shop on national TV with her private parts out for all to see either.

Kat said...

So, I'm going to play Devil's Advocate and look at it from a different angle because I'm on the fence about Jon.

Yes, he is sitting contently on this shameful ride. However, I don't think he has the capability to have thought this out and execute everything that you see happening to this family. When you read or hear about all the deals and contracts and agreements that have taken place, Kate has always been the mastermind behind a lot of what I feel is manipulation. She has manipulated the community, her Church(es), her famiy, her friends, and the system.

Although Jon is standing alongside her, I feel as though he is caught up in this fiasco because he doesn't know any other way around it. And if you can't beat her, then join her, right?

I'm not writing in defense of his actions or lack thereof. I think his speach at the multiple convention in Boston reflects his situation clearly, "I can't leave her because I will be the poorest man alive." (or something to that effect)

Is he a loving father who would do anything for his kids? Yes, I truly believe he is. And although the snippets of their lives that we have watched are edited and contrived, this man does more for his kids in one day than their mother does for them in a week!! I see genuine affection, love, and concern for their happiness and well-being. (Putting the whole camera-in-your-face 24/7, aside.)

Is he sometimes flippant and impatient with them? Yes, but given his age, I have seen worse. He is a young father who was handed way more than he could handle at a very inappropriate time in his life. Although I agree that doing NOTHING is just as bad as committing the crime yourself, regarding the gravy train-wreck we watch week after week, I would put him up as the better parent, hands down.

Let's say he is miserable with Kate and really is sleeping in the basement (as what was posted at some point or another). Let's say he is unhappy with how his kids are being raised and the type of mother she is. For someone who is not very aggressive, I think he would have a difficult time standing up and saying ENOUGH. He knows in court, this woman will rip him a new one and he wouldn't know which way it was coming.

If I were the judge sitting on the bench at their family court trial, I think the kids would be better off with him than with Kate. Unfortunately, this man lacks the sense and the conviction to stand up to his wife because I'm assuming that he feels he is too far gone in their web of lies and there is no painless way to get out of it.

So, he will stay, and lie, and stand back and take orders....All while smiling for the cameras.

Anonymous said...

My guess is Jon will read this and the author will get an email saying "He does the best I can."

I don't burst into laughter too often at the computer, but you got me!!! That is a GREAT line!

another topic:

I think if Jon or Kate stayed home with the kids because they won the lottery or came into a great inheritance I'd be alright with it.
It's not really Jon and/or Kate not working that is the issue, it's that they are LIVING OFF OF THEIR KIDS that is the issue.

I'd love for my children to have both my husband and myself home all day to care for and nurture them, but not at their expense. Sorry!

FIONA said...

I'm sure Kate would love her kids to be the next Britney, Baio, Donny and Marie

____

They would be better off. At least then, there would be laws protecting them.

Nat said...

I think we all know that expecting Kon to give it all up and get a job and start living with pride and integrety is just never ever ever gona happen. These two money grubbers are going to hang on till the bitter end. Theres going to be 2 sets of heel marks all the way to the door.

But at the very least PLEASE stop showing your precious kids changing and going potty and crying and give them some friggen privacy for god sake! And PLEASE stop making fun of them... your not laughing WITH them are you? They deserve that much dont they?

5monkeys said...

Kat, I enjoyed reading your post.

I don't doubt that Jon loves his kids. But he has to have some sense to realize that enough is enough already.

Is he that afraid of Kate to just say "no" to her? Parents need to stand up for their kids, if not anything else.

I don't know how much money they make, but I do hope that there is someone (a professional) handling their finances, and making sure they don't spend every last penny and that money is getting saved. For their childrens' sakes.

Liz said...

In some ways I understand that it is great to get free trips and stuff but at what price? The twins are going into 2nd grade and I would bet they are going to start getting made fun of. I have a 7 year old and I can tell you she is always telling me Mom don't do this or say this in front of my friends. These kids have all time on TV for all of America to see. Not every child wants their friends watching them have a melt down. Or having their friends watch thier mother yelling and putting down thier father.It can make for a miserable childhood. One of my major goals with my kids is that when they look back on their childhood they can say it was good. Money surely does not buy happiness.

Anonymous said...

I'm a casual viewer of the show. Cute kids.I also live a couple of towns over from J & K. I've never seen her but I have seen him a couple of times. Not to speak but from a distance. The man just doesn't look happy. Both times I saw him he looked miserable. Slumped shoulders, head down. Maybe he was just having a bad day or maybe he's just really browbeaten.Like I said, I didn't talk too him, but I wasn't that far away from him. I get a submissive vibe from him.Hopefully I'll get to see him again and hopefully Kate.That's my z list sighting. And in RL he's not that handsome. Kinda meh looking IMO.

Anonymous said...

I was just watching TLC and the program came on about them picking apples and pumpkins. Wow! What a difference back then. The little kids looked to be abut 2. In the chair, Jon described how he and Kate compliment one another, with their different personalities. He said that seeing all that she does with them at home...he was so thankful for his job and how he would NEVER want to be at home all day. Also, I noticed that they took equal time in explaining what was happening in their lives; so she must have been more restrained back then. It was like they were enjoying discovering all of the little nuiances of the emerging persoalities of the kids, as she looked fondly at them and proudly mentioned what each one did or said. Now, it's like the honeymoon is over FOREVER. Even though they are older and can communicate, and they do get more self sufficient as they get older...She complains more, screams, shouts, he tries to express himself and she cuts him off. It's like an Army General has emerged and they will never go back to the relationship they once had. Sadly, in the earlier episodes, she seemed genuinely interested in all of the kids, not showing a preference or any disgust towards the boys. Evidently she is disappointed in who they are now and she seems more harried now that the trips have increased, along with the hired help.
This relationship is definitely going down the tubes--not so much because of so many kids, but probably because of both staying home, and meeting the demands of being celebrities.

Anonymous said...

"Kat said...
So, I'm going to play Devil's Advocate and look at it from a different angle because I'm on the fence about Jon."


I'm with you.

I've noticed how the children gravitate to Jon, and he seems to be a loving, affectionate dad. He often speaks to them in a kind, soothing way. I think he is very proud of all of them, but seems to be in a whopper of a difficult situation.

I had friends once (sibs), one an aggressive person with a huge ego, the other quiet and passive with low self-esteem. If something happened that upset the quiet one, she rarely spoke up because if she did the other one would get mad and ignore her for weeks on end. I'm not saying Jon has low self-esteem, but he is on the quiet side; possibly a similar situation?

Jon seems like a warm-hearted, fun-loving person. I say give the guy a chance.

Cassandra said...

As for this "We" business...

Most young women would be ashamed to refer to their husbands' accomplishments as an extension of their own. But again, it's a different time.

3. These days, you need a college degree just to get by (yes yes, unless you're Kon). One set of grandparents of mine went to college and were very well off. The other set finished junior high and were fine. College educated doesn't mean as much in this flooded market.

I could go on...just a reminder to the older set not to calculate the worth of the younger set with a rusty slide rule.


1) Both my husband and I worked most of our lives. When I was a stay-at-home mom, I always also happened to work part time. I just mentioned his longevity because I AM proud of him... I am not yet 80 ;) We are each collecting SS based on our own income. We both have pensions.

2) We are both college educated. My husband also has a Masters. He's an engineer... they don't make very big salaries. But it is funny that you mentioned a rusty slide rule. He actually used to use slide rules. Now he enjoys using a computer.

3) Yes, I guess I'm lucky that I was never divorced. My husband was... and he paid alimony and child support. Then he sent his kids to college.

4) We could not afford ANY "vacations" when our kids were as young as the Gosselin kids. But we can now... and that is why I say WE EARNED it.

mlou said...

RE:The Pumpkin Episode

I will admit you can see a big difference between J&K's relationship, however, if you'll notice even then Kate's OCD was out of control. She stopped her husband and kids in the middle of a fun family moment of carving pumpkins to clean the mess. She could have sucked it up and went away and let her kids enjoy a simple childhood memory. But as I later found out, this is not Kate's style. I do truly feel sorry for her but not as much as I do these kids.

Barbara in VA said...

I agree with the poster who said Jon is and always will be the better parent. It did not surprise me that someone like Kate, meaning her personality as we see it depicted in the show, would choose someone slightly younger than herself and slightly less educated. And it does not surprise me that Jon perhaps was flattered by that attention enough to marry Kate, who apparently has changed a whole lot since then or so it seems from the show. I do think Jon is a capable parent, funny, easy-going, good instincts and if he were allowed to do so I think he would bring these children up to be happy and healthy, well rounded individuals. When he heard Collin at the golf outing moaning about dirty hands he at least tried by saying "Who cares? Be dirty. I don't care". And I thought, well, finally, and good for him!!! Well done, Jon. But can his, as was mentioned above, slightly submissive personality ever override that hysterical screeching personality of his wife? That's the question. I really think we should all encourage Jon in his parenting (if he, in fact, reads or cares what we the viewers think at all) because he's got the right stuff while she clearly does not.
Barbara in VA

somewhereinthemiddle said...

Interesting discussion. I really wanted to be swayed in favor of Jon. When I started watching the show I really like his "every guy" attitude. But more and more lately I'm coming to see him in a negative light. I just saw the Hair Plugs epsiode, and he came off very badly in it. The way he spoke to Kate when she was removing the staples was not only rude and unkind but downright venomous. His tone can be every bit as cutting as Kate - and I mean when he speaks to the kids and when he speaks to his wife. I have in mind when he sent Collin (I think) to the step when he tried to get in the wrong van, when he told Joel not to move (or something like that) when they were packing, when he snaps "get downstairs" almost every episode. When he told Collin it was okay to be dirty, but wasn't as if he were comforting his child to make it okay. Instead he seemed to be getting on to him for worrying about getting dirty. I do think he enjoys the kids more than Kate, and he is more hands-on. However, I'm not buying that he is submissive and downtrodden by the evil Kate. I've come to the conclusion that Jon gives as good as he gets. Kate's biting tone is more constant, but Jon's, when it flares, it much sharper.

Anonymous said...

You know, I really do think I could forgive Jon and Kate for all the freebies they get. I don't think less of them because they don't have a lot of higher education. I don't fault Jon for not having a career goal or a lot of ambition; most people are adults and still don't know "what they want to do when they grow up," so they just find a job (say, in IT) and suck it up.

But.

The gender biases and stereotyping and mockery is so hurtful and untrue and *ignorant* that I don't think I could ever call Jon (or Kate) a "good" parent. Never. Yes, maybe Jon could encourage the children to be less worried about messes, to the point where "Disgusting hands!" wouldn't work as an insult. But if the boys still fear using a purple and pink bike or wearing high heels or crying, or they learn that being called a girl is insulting, then that's a sign of supremely bad parenting.

Nat said...

seti said "Most young women would be ashamed to refer to their husbands' accomplishments as an extension of their own."

What?!?!? I am in my mid 30's (hopefully not what most would consider old) and OF COURSE I consider my husbands accomplishments to be an extension of my own!!! We are a family unit and its our job to support and encourage each other and its doubtful we would have accomplished nearly as much without that support. I consider the accomplishments of everyone in the family an extension of my own. I started my own business when I was 26 and I'm very proud of that and so is my husband, but its the accomplishments of the entire family that I'm most proud of (ESPECIALLY those of my husband) and I am definitely not ashamed to say it.

Katherine said...

Not that all parents are perfect, but I think the majority of people can say that both their parents (if they had both growing up) had good and bad qualities. The lesssor of the two evils on this show, is really obvious, though.

If you asked me if I would rather live with a disorganized and "soft" father who loves me unconditionally or a super clean, money-hungry, aggressive mother who scares me, then I'd pick the submissive father any day of the week.

It may mean that expensive vacations and million dollar houses will not be part of our lifestyle. Knowing you can go to your parent for everything and anything you need (no matter how DIRTY you are)is something money can't buy.

Sorry, Kate. I would have wife-swapped your ass out of there YEARS ago!!

(In my opinion, I doubt Jon would have quit his job if Kate wasn't pressuring him to do so. He's not opportunistic enough to go out and find this vehicle for an easy lifesyle on his own.)

annabandana said...

Jon seems like a warm-hearted, fun-loving person. I say give the guy a chance.

This "warm-hearted, fun loving person" sits back and lets his wife terrorize his children.

Those kids are AFRAID of Kate. That is not normal. She cares more about her own needs than those of her kids. She thinks in terms of what the kids have to offer her, not vice versa.

All the while, Jon watches. He says nothing. He does nothing.

I will cut him NO slack!

Travis said...

Anonymous said...

But if the boys still fear using a purple and pink bike or wearing high heels or crying, or they learn that being called a girl is insulting, then that's a sign of supremely bad parenting.


I totally agree. My son has a pink sippy cup that my husband saw him using (hand-me-down from a female cousin). Instead of freaking out, he simply said "Cool buddy. Only real men can rock pink like that". No big deal!

Anonymous said...

Oh, agreed many times over that Jon should not be so passive when Kate is "terrorizing" the children. I'd love to see him step up and change the situation. Don't know if he's quite there yet. I'd sure rather have him as a parent than her if I were a child even though he speaks, ya know, like a guy without any sugar coating. Do this, stop it, go downstairs, etc. Give me that over sarcasm any day of the week.

To the last poster, your husband did the right thing for sure. Big friggin' deal what color a cup is, come on. Wonder why the huge gender thing is going on in that household? Does one of them have a gay brother or sister and they are worried about that happening? I'm just asking.

Anonymous said...

This sterotyping gender thing is getting way out of hand. I caught part of the rerun epi of Joel's day out and he wanted to play dress up, jon mentioned at home they only had girl things (Heellloooo?? Ever hear of Salvation Army for some 'guy' stuff since there isn't any 'guy' stuff in your closet Jon??)and on the couch J&K made mention of how from the get go Joel had always been into lipstick and nail polish. Carrying purses (albeit with trucks inside). My point being that if they continue to berate and belittle him with comments about how he is girlish they could be heading down a slippery slope. IMO gays are gay from birth even if they go thru a period of denial and try dating the opposite sex. I won't pretend to speak for J&K but I can't imagine that having a gay son would be something they would be at all comfortable with. Forget he is healthy, smart, cute, dependable and whatever else he grows up to be. At 4 and 5 children can and do remember things send to them by adults. How hurtful, not to mention just plain wrong, their words and actions are. I confess and I am sure most parents will, that they made their own mistakes with their children when they were small. By the second or third one you finally get a handle on things. The way I see it,J&K have a wonderful opportunity to learn something about raising their children from this blog.
I saw a quote that Jon made about watching the rough cut episodes and how they were like therapy sessions in that they could see things they were doing wrong and apologize and hopefully correct it. IMO I am afraid that was just more of the same 'ol- same 'ol....playing to the camera. Jon-WHEN you read this just know that it's coming from a good place and is only meant to save you from yourself.
And to the little boy with the pink sippy---rock on little dude!!
Lisa

Chris said...

When the little boy next door was about 3 or 4, I cleaned out the garage and sent over a bunch of old toys. One of them was a Barbie Big Wheel. His mother didn't think he'd play with it because he thought "Barbie is for girls".

He rode that big wheel most afternoons until they moved, and it moved with them. I guess a Barbie big wheel was better than no big wheel.

ThreeFarmers said...

When I was growing up our house was a dysfunctional nightmare. My parents were divorcing and my sisters were both much older than me and going through their own teenage dramas. Thank goodness my Grandma only lived two blocks away. Grandma's house was always such a quiet safe haven when home was just too impossible to deal with.

My mother was a serious Kate and had me when she was 40. By then she was DONE with children. She also would hold grudges against us. If I didn't pick up my room or do some other chore, she wouldn't speak to me for days or she would refuse to do my laundry. I remember piling my dirty school uniform (Catholic) into the basket of my bicycle (with the red tassels and purple banana seat, thank you very much) and riding over to my Grandma's so she could wash it for me. There, I got plenty of love no matter how naughty I was.

I'm not saying that Kate has reached the level of my mother (yet), but what a comfort loving Grandparents could be for those children. Especially Mady and Cara.
All the amusement parks and nannies in the world can't fill the gap like Grandma and Grandpa can.

The longer I watch this show, the larger the gap left by the absence of family seems.

Anonymous said...

Hi Three--Isn't is wonderful that you were blessed with such a Grandma? There's nothing better!

Anonymous said...

Last year my entire family had a reunion. My husband and I were slammed with an emergency bill for one of my kids and decided that all of the money we saved for our reunion, plane tickets, etc HAD to go to the bill. We could have been put on a payment plan, but we had the money for the trip. So, we reported to our family that we just couldn't afford this trip.

Our entire family donated a few dollars here and there and gave us the trip so that we could be there. The thing is, it was really hard to accept that money. But we were reminded of the times we were able to be there for our family financially, and ended up accepting their generosity without being ungrateful about it.

When I see this family go on these lavish trips and take advantage of everything anyone ever offers them without once seeing them try to give back, it makes me sad. They have so many opportunities for generosity, but fail every time. We never see them do anything kind for anyone else. It really makes me sad, and I hope those children learn the joy of giving some day as adults.

Whitney said...

There are some things that I believe fall onto the man's shoulders. One is bearing the brunt of the financial responsibility if it has been determined that it is in the best interest of the family for the mother to stay at home.
In other words, JON,grow up. Be a man. Be a father. Be a real husband. You and your family deserve it.


I’m going to school to be a veterinarian (or a doctor if I don’t get into vet school –it’s a lot harder to get into Veterinary school than it is to get into Med School. You’d be surprised at the number of doctors out there who wanted to be vets but just didn’t make the cut.) When I’m through with school and have a job I will be making more than my boyfriend (who will hopefully be my husband by then). Now, I’m not putting down anything that he does (he’s a mechanic at a dealership and anything that has to do with cars and engines just boggle my mind) but when it comes right down to it he’s said that he’d be willing to stay at home and have me work. If you look at how much we’d each make one of me working would equal two or three of him working. Although having a vet or doctor’s salary isn’t necessary it would make life a lot easier. I don’t think the ‘Man needs to be a MAN!’ IMHO, that ship sailed in the 50s.

ThreeFarmers said...

It was quite wonderful. She died in 2002, 7 months before her 100th birthday. Bless her. She taught me everything, how to cook, how to sew, how to do laundry.

She was such a character though. She was raising a family during the depression and everything they had was used or a hand-me-down. By the time I knew her, she had a real dislike for all things old and drab. When Grandpa passed, she painted every room in her big house PINK.. the place looked like it was hosed down with Pepto Bismol. She also didn't hang on to anything. When she died, so many people asked me if I got all my Grandmother's antiques (she had a big old house and had lived there forever, everyone assumed it was filled with treasures). The woman didn't own any antiques. She was famous for giving things away or having spontaneous yard sales. The only thing she kept were her Rosaries.

When she died I found over 50 Rosaries stashed all over that house.

Chela said...

Whitney, I completely agree that if a man and wife agree to have the man at home with the children for a variety of reasons, then yes the WOMAN would then be responsible for the family's income. That is not the case here. They both chose to have the mother stay home for their children. Then HE as the parent still in the workplace should do what is necessary to meet that responsilbity.
I am currently at home with my two girls and am a full-time student in an MBA program. My husband and I made the decision for me to stop working. In addition to pursuing a higher education, I get the added blessing of raising my daughters myself. This decision requires sacrifices by our entire family but we make them, because it is the best decision for us at this time. Once I graduate, we will switch roles. I will go back to work full-time (with the higher salary that goes with an MBA) and my husband will return to school for HIS MBA. And you know why? Because I intend to be a real WOMAN, a real MOTHER, and a real WIFE by supporting my family while my husband takes care of our girls and finishes his graduate studies.
And while a lot of things have changed since the 50s, one thing remains unchanged since the beginning of time. WOMEN bear and birth children, whether this seems fair or unfair to some, the bottom line is WOMEN are usually the ones who bear the brunt of the responsibility of raising children. You know why? We are built for it, from our hips to our arms to our everexpanding heart and souls, that is the role we were made for.

iluveeyore said...

"I don’t think the ‘Man needs to be a MAN!’ IMHO, that ship sailed in the 50s.

I totally agree with you.

However, IIRC Jon himself, in an interview, was discussing how he was fired while Kate was pregnant with the tups. He said it was doubly awful because a man wants to be able to support his family. He might have made that statement on tv, but I cannot recall on which show.

BTW, there seems to be new information appearing that brings Jon's "firing" into question. It seems that his former employer said that he never fired Jon, he just stopped coming to work. He was not pleased with being shown as the bad guy.

Linda said...

nnabandana said...

Jon seems like a warm-hearted, fun-loving person. I say give the guy a chance.

This "warm-hearted, fun loving person" sits back and lets his wife terrorize his children.

Those kids are AFRAID of Kate. That is not normal. She cares more about her own needs than those of her kids. She thinks in terms of what the kids have to offer her, not vice versa.

All the while, Jon watches. He says nothing. He does nothing.

I will cut him NO slack!


And equally as guilty is the production staff at figure8/tlc who are watching what goes on and does not report anything. Legally, a witness of abuse who does not report it is equally guilty. How could someone stand by and not react to hearing children mocked, teased and yelled at, not to mention the 'spankings' that KON admits they use as discipline. The children, including the twins, flinch when their parents grab for them.

And, IMO, Mady is a symptom of the family and not the family problem

jayley said...

"We never see them do anything kind for anyone else."

A great learning experience for the whole family might be a TRIP to needed charities in their hometown. Spring cleaning time in our home has become a family tradition for all to gather and donate toys and clothes that are no longer used, or fit. Womens shelters, the homeless, low income school districts, the list goes on. The best part is the pride and satisfaction that children gain by helping others less fortunate, and we are by no means upper class. They also learn that "things" are not important, but people are. imo hope i got that right...

iluveeyore said...

"It seems that his former employer said that he never fired Jon, he just stopped coming to work. He was not pleased with being shown as the bad guy."

iluveeyore...

Where does this info come from?


I am making a concerted effort to track down the source of this information. If I am unable to find it, I will tell you so.

Anonymous said...

Linda said....
"Those kids are AFRAID of Kate. That is not normal. She cares more about her own needs than those of her kids. She thinks in terms of what the kids have to offer her, not vice versa."

I agree they may be afraid of her but not in an abnormal way, Kate and Jon have both said that she is the disciplinarian and Jon is the fun parent. The problem though, is that she disciplines Jon, too which IS abnormal.

ThreeFarmers said...

I don't think any former employer ever made that comment. I found one person posting as Lynn Smith on some blog who said it, but cited no source, but only said "a local paper".

I searched a few local papers, but the closest I could find was in the Central Pennsylvania Patriot News on July 9, 2004, and it was Jon making them print a correction saying he wasn't fired but was let go for budgetary reasons.

People putting information out there need to be to be sure of the information and not post speculation as fact. When the info is wrong it gives the Gosselins an excuse to tell their fans to question the credibility of everything that's out there.

That same paper printed a correction from Kate as well when they apparently ran a story saying she said "society" should support their family. The correction she wanted printed said she didn't want society to be responsible, but that there should be "resources available" to those in situations such as hers.

Don't ask me what the difference is between "society" and "resources", I don't know. If society isn't going to provide those resources, then someone better the Fairy God-Mother right away. Sounds like spin to me. Of course Jon's budgetary reasons could be that the company didn't have the budget to pay someone who wasn't pulling his weight on the job. Who knows. Either way, it's time that that particular "news" item be put to rest until someone can document it.
Besides, it doesn't may any difference on Jon's current and former employment history. Does he have a job? Not that I can tell.

What is interesting is that the paper has run several letters to the editor from people complaining about the Gosselins. They have been getting bad press from the beginning, deserved or not. I don't know why they are so shocked that there is so much negativity out there since people were suspicious of them long before they were on television. None of this backlash should be a surprise.

They are going to get run down by their own gravy train and they saw it coming all along.

Linda said...

Anonymous said...
I agree they may be afraid of her but not in an abnormal way, Kate and Jon have both said that she is the disciplinarian and Jon is the fun parent. The problem though, is that she disciplines Jon, too which IS abnormal.


I have 3 children and not one of them are afraid of me. I never had to 'spank' them (just mho, not meant as a debate on parenting) and they never, never, never have flinched when I reached for them.
rewatch the scene on the Thomas train, when Jon came at Mady (because of hairgate) and she was cowering and wincing. My kids (19,16,13) are not perfect and neither am I, but it has never been my feeling that having to be afraid of someone you love is normal. BTW-I raised my kids alone and was the sole disciplinarian. I don't "rule with fear", I teach with love.

Anonymous said...

some investigative reporter should pick this up as a story and investigate and report to the public about the way these people are living off of donations etc. It would really open people's eyes. That John guy from 20/20 has just the right sarcasim to do it right! They could ask psychologist if this is health for the children etc. Could be an interesting end to all of this madness!

Anonymous said...

Did anyone other than myself notice on the beach show that the camera man was focusing on the boys's butt cracks when their swim trunks came down. Another thing that I found disturbing was when on of the tup girls was running down the beach the camera was aimed at her little butt as she ran. I think this kind of filming is very distastful, and figure 8 should not film these children in this light. It is very inappropriate. I dont understand why this kind of filming of these children is being allowed?

sistah2 said...

RE: discussion of Jon's job above - I am sure the blog admin's will find it, but somewhere on this site, not long ago, a former co-worker of Jon's told the inside story of what really happened with the job. He was not fired, just stopped showing up, is what was posted. Then someone in the comment section researched the story.

iluveeyore said...

This is the best I could do. I suspect that this is what I was referring to. You may choose to accept or reject this comment.

"The Truth About the Move"
post by Linnea

linnea said...

You hit the nail right on the head Anon. 08:22. I live in Central PA and remember the hoopla surrounding the tups birth. Actually, Kon went to the local media before the tups birth to make sure we all knew it was coming and to donate accordingly. A few weeks before the tups arrived, Jon went to the Patriot News and gave a sad story about how his mean employer fired him for missing too much work. Readers were conveniently directed to his new gosselinsix.com website so we could contribute to items from their "wish list." Jon's employer contacted the Patriot and made it very clear they DID NOT FIRE JON. He just stopped showing up one day, and they didn't apreciate having their name dragged through the mud. Some of his co-workers said Jon acted he was never going to have to work again and spoke of the things they would receive like the other famous multiples families got............

linnea said...

I am the one who posted about Jon leaving his job. I also posted a "retraction" of sorts a few days later when I could not find the article to verify my post. Even though some of my family memebers and friends remembered this situation as well, "remembering is not fact" I wrote after doing some research. I do not want to give J&K any ammunition to discredit what is said here, so I subscribed to the Patriot's archives to look for the article. It was not there, only the correction Jon requested stating he was not fired but let go for budgetary reasons. IMO, where there's smoke there's fire. I feel the correction Jon requested shows there was a discrepancy with that situation. I am wondering if the article I was referring to was not archived because it was considered trivial or not newsworthy, therefore not archived. Also, they only archived three letters to the editor regarding the "Nursegate" scandal. There were many, many, many more than three letters written to the editor of the Patriot about the Gosselins wanting their state-paid nurse indefinitely.

What we are left to wonder now is which job was it that Jon claims fired him when he tried to get insurance for 10?

The fact that the mystery cyber bully wrote to BK and said "stop spreading rumors true or not" spoke volumes to me. It seems this person was actually saying "stop digging up all our shameless deeds from the past- it's blowing our carefully created facade." The fact that BKs identity was revealed in four hours shows that this blog IS being monitored and seems to be causing certain individuals some concern. What is trying to be accomplished here is working, and by no means do I want to detract from that.

Anonymous said...

I am going on a limb here.

A two-branched limb.

I don't think Jon is spineless and I think it is rude to refer to him that way. He is a grown man and when they opted to have cameras in their home and sign contracts and such to support that filming, I could see how Kate NEEDED him at home to manage all that.

My family did a "reality" show of sorts--one involving remodeling a home...but still. The show came on weekends to film and my parents had to bust it to get the home where it needed to be for filming..but on actual film days--they busted their buns even more. Camera work is exhausting even though it "appears as though you are doing nothing".


Now--my eyes have been opened up to the Gosselins, but some of this is just rude when it comes to "slamming" the parents. Him physically not reporting to an office doesn't equate to laziness. (My husband's office is our master bedroom and with a reality camera it would seriously look like his "job" is simple looking power point presentations when the "job" is wayyyyyyyy much more than that and has the potential to be worth beaucoup bucks for his employer).

Kind of casting stones at that point IMHO.

Now here Jon could stand up--is to not let Kate walk all over him. That I can agree too. Why? B/c I do it to my husband. In fact--"I" got so bad that I have sought therapy for it which is working beautifully and most of my present day behavior is traced back to problems in youth that we are finally addressing.

I think Kate is rude to Jon. I do think it is funny at times only b/c I have seen myself do it and finally realize how embarrassing and humiliating can be. So this show has served a purpose for me--to IMPROVE my behavior.

But these folks are far from unemployed. They are contracted to a television show to provide access. Those cameras probably come in for stretches of 10-12 hour days when they do come (using my past knowledge of what my family did for the show they contracted to).

The kids--need to only be protected (IMHO) from 2 points: They should never be forced to go in front of the camera by being permitted to walk away (as Mady I think does--though she does it in a VERY bratty and rude way)--and their bedroom should be the SAFE zone. So not only can they leave filming, they can go to a protected space.

Notice how extremely rare it is for the camera to go into Jon and Kate's master bedroom. The kids should be afforded that. Plenty of kiddo footage available at other times.

Also--they should get legally protected fractions of the income their family gets from this show placed into a trust. In much the same manner as a regular actor. But keep in mind, a regular actor has business expenses which includes managers and such, so they don't necessarily get 100% of their income either. (Don't forget taxes).

But after that--I don't think these kids are being exploited like little actor robots. They aren't "working". They get their meal times, nap times and such--they will have school either in a regular school or as governed by the homeschooling laws of their state of residence.

I think full exploitation is a stretch. Parents are the protectors of their kids. And the kids for the MOST part seem to enjoy the camera.

My problem with this show (if I had one) is that I just wish they would see the light, especially Kate.

But as for most addicts--those with "issues" of any kind can never get help unless they admit they have a problem. Kate doesn't really see that she has a problem.

No act of Congress will ever make that happen unfortunately.

And while their are websites by family and what not--we really don't know both sides to every story and interaction to know for certain that this is all Jon and Kate's doing.

But really--how many times does it happen in this world where someone catches a big break and some folks try to come along for the ride?

The evidence does point to that not being true--but history shows, even with all the evidence out there against the Gosselins, that that thought is ALWAYS a possibility.

Depending on how the producers are spinning all of this--I can't place the full blame on the Gosselins for all of their behavior.

Isn't it remotely possible that the production company *maybe* led the Gosselins to believe all that. Maybe the company sees the money making potential of this family--and from the very beginning have orchestrated to make sure that Jon and Kate stay on board.

Couldn't it be possible that they had a hand in the Jody contract incident? What show on this planet do you know of where the producers went behind the stars back to stir the pot and let someone know they wanted to put them under contract but the star wouldn't allow it. I mean--we all see how Kate is. Is Figure 8 that naive to think they would get away with it?

Lots of babbling and for that I apologize--but the Gosselins are one big machine being oiled by Figure 8--they are employed.

Ever pay attention to the Women of Faith conferences--I met the ladies at their hotel one morning and Sheila Walsh has posh luggage--like prada or something (don't know all my designers). I mean she is FULLY outfitted. Womemn of Faith is a machine--yet noone faults the ladies for publishing new books annually and charging oodles of money to attend their events. A $25,000 speakers fee wouldn't be enough to cover that big show.

So for the Gosselins to charge a speakers fee--let's look at the entire circuit. You crucify one, you must crucify all.

Jon has a job. May not be one that we would choose or do to our families--but he is self-employed as Kate is and as Mady, Cara, Joel, Collin, Leah, Alexis, Hannah and I forgot the last one....

They are contracted with Figure 8 and they get paid. They have jobs.

While they make some poor choices--Jon made some good ones to field that gig.

sistah2 said...

From what I can remember, someone else wrote in who knew of the situation, and said that the employer sat down and explained to Jon how much his insurance premiums would go up when the tups were born. No one fired him, this poster insisted. Its buried somewhere on this site.

$howMeDa$$ said...

Since these children are technically working - are they getting paid? No. Not the money/perks that their dumb parents are racking in, but literally a check for each child that is put away until they are of legal age? When they are 18 - or even 16, the legal working age - are they going to get THEIR cut of all this madness? Not the scholarships, not the damn love offerings... Actual paychecks for they lack of privacy, lack of a childhood, for the lack of knowing anyone or anything real or normal. How's 'bout a overtime bonus for 'acting' like it's christmas day, opening presents and eating 'christmas dinner' two weeks before the true Christmas Day..

mlou said...

RE:Jon has a job. May not be one that we would choose or do to our families--but he is self-employed as Kate is and as Mady, Cara, Joel, Collin, Leah, Alexis, Hannah and I forgot the last one....

First of all, the last child's name is Aaden. Secondly, these kids are 8 and 4, how can you say they are self-employed. Also, in reference to the restrictions that you would have on the show, I noticed that you agreed that they do need safe zones in their bedrooms. But what about when they are using the restroom or constipated or bathing. You also mentioned that your family was on a reality show, would you tell me how many people in your household were minors? Did they have private shots taken of them? Also you said that it was a home improvement show, IMO that is quite different than a 40 episode season. I am glad that you realized you needed help and got it. For the sakes of these kids I hope Kate does as well.

Anonymous said...

In response I will say--yes we were minors--we didn't appear on the show until the last episode b/c we were in school (many years ago and I just recalled that work was done on weekends and filming was during the week--this was an unintentional mistake not meant to deceive).

Self-employed: paid for work contracted and get a 1099 ( I think--) and not a W-2 from the people who paid you.

Age has no bearing--you see that Gerber commercial with a baby--meets the qualifications of self-employed. The baby has no employer, but that baby has a gig and got paid for it. Now he can't talk or sign his name or read a contract or drive himself to the job...but he's self-employed.

Didn't add the bathrooms didn't mean I think that shouldn't be included. But if I wanted to hide from a camera, I certainly wouldn't want to seek a bathroom for comfort and privacy--so I didn't mention it b/c I don't count that as a "safe haven". In the beginning--showing diaper changes and such were part of demonstrating the challenges of parenting sextuplets. Potty training--sort of the same thing.

They don't show Cara and Mady using the potty or showering--so at some point (I would hope) they would show the same decorum for the sextuplets and at some point indecency laws would come into play.

But I didn't mention it b/c again--I wouldn't want the only safe haven I could go would be to a bathroom--akin to nursing moms and their rights..a bathroom doesn't equate to an appropriate solution.

It was no reflection or insinuation of a belief that filming in the bathroom was an okay thing to do or that it shouldn't be stopped. But I would hope that the kids deserved more respect that to have a room with a toilet as their only place to hang when they didn't want to be filmed.

This show exists b/c of the children, so most assuredly they are mentioned in the contract somewhere. Until we see physical copies of said signed contract, we don't really know their place on the paycheck or obligation.

At 8 and 4 they cannot legally sign a contract--but a contract can be created as is done with any other child in a reality show.

And what was that crazy Bonanza reality show they had last year with kids. Those kids were covered by laws I am sure--but they were MUCH MUCH MUCH different than for youth actors and actresses b/c filming what you do isn't necessarily equated with "working" and having a "job". And what those kids did Sucked. But there is NO WAY they were only filming that show for so many hours at a time and taking long breaks and such. Absolutely no way. I know folks had their issues with that show--but on that show, those kids were without parents for several weeks.

And I certainly hope the folks here have tackled another avenue which is totally the same...embarrassing children for profit: America's funniest videos. That show has been around for over 20 years--and while each child may only have been embarrassed twice: at taping of said embarrassing moment and initial airing....there are reruns and reruns and repackaging of episodes and reruns.

Parents have choices on how to rear their children and while there are certain things that I may not do or that I think probably shoudln't be done, I just don't feel that this show qualifies as exploitation. Honestly--I truly don't.

And speaking of ignoring kids--off to change an exploding diaper at the moment.

ThreeFarmers said...

I could not find anything printed in the Patriot that said that. I paid for the articles I read and there's a limit to the amount of $ that I'm going to fork out.

I used to work at a newspaper about the size of the Patriot and they use the same archive service and that service keeps everything. If such an article (corrections and retractions included) it would have shown up in the search.

elleroy said...

mom22 said...
Bee - I totally agree with you. I saved money for 2 years and went to Corolla this June for 2 weeks it fantastic.
Jon & Kate have a different opportunity then the rest of us. Yes their decisions may not be the same ones most us would make but we should not judge them. It's a biz and they are doing quite well. yes the cameras and the nudity is strange and I think inappropriate I would not allow my 2 kids to do it but again their decisions. As far as children with the cameras there all the time - there are plenty of child stars who are just fine. Scott Baio - Ricky Schoerder and I'm too tired to think of others. I know I'm probably a very unpopular commenter but I had to say it - I think you are all going too far with this open letter.

They've put themselves out there in the public eye, so yes, we most certainly do have the right to judge them, especially with regard to the fact that their decisions regarding the children are at best inappropriate. The nudity is more than strange, it's robbing those kids of their privacy. As far as the child actors you mentioned in your post, they are just that - child actors. The Gosselins are not actors. They have cameras on them in their home filming their most private moments and in their rooms when they probably don't even realize it. Much different from choosing an acting career, showing up for work and going back to your life.
I don't think it's going too far to expect parents to put their children above themselves and protect them.

SmartyQ said...

sistah2 said... From what I can remember, someone else wrote in who knew of the situation, and said that the employer sat down and explained to Jon how much his insurance premiums would go up when the tups were born. No one fired him, this poster insisted. Its buried somewhere on this site.
I remember too. The employer explained to Jon how much Jon's insurance premium would go up if Jon put the tups on his company insurance plan. (Kate was carried by her hospital insurance plan, so presumably Jon was covering the twins and him.) The big BUT is that the State of Pennsylvania would have covered the tups from birth, so Jon wouldn't have had any increase in his insurance premiums.

Here are Jon's own words from the Triplet Connection: 'After we found our we were having six kids my employer told me that he couldn't afford our insurance and he fired me. I tried to fight in court but in PA "fire at will" is legal. So I was unemployed for 8 months.'

The interesting part of Jon's story is that we are being asked to believe the employer fired him long before the insurance premiums would have escalated. Kon learned at six weeks of the seven sacs— long before there was any chance of Kate's pregnancy being carried to viable birth. At the point Jon says he was fired, the possibility of any of the embryos surviving to become fetuses was academic.

Was Jon lying, too stupid to understand what his employer was telling him, or had he finally found the excuse he wanted so that he didn't have to work? Draw your own conclusions.

Anonymous said...

Even if this shady-shifty story of the insurance woes IS true, my question is, what kind of man doesn't work for EIGHT MONTHS while his wife is expecting 6 or 7 babies???

Heck, go sell fish to tourists in T-shirts, if you have to. Something.

Whitney said...

My sister's husband is one of those can't keep a job type. Sadly enough for her she doesn't see through the whole facade. He was even given a job by my dad at his company which he couldn't even keep (even when my dad was holding off from firing him--long story). What my point is is that some people are just more immature than others. He has a child much like Jon (and a couple others from what I know) yet he can't keep a job for the life of him.

After having heard all the excuses out there I don't buy it. A lot of people have kids and work. A lot of people go to school and work at the same time. A lot of people go to school, have kids and work at the same time. I don't care who fired who, who quit or why you need to tuck your shirt back in put a smile on and get another job.

Travis said...

Anonymous said...

Heck, go sell fish to tourists in T-shirts, if you have to. Something.



I nominate this for comment of the week. I almost fell out of my chair!

iluveeyore said...

And what was that crazy Bonanza reality show they had last year with kids. Those kids were covered by laws I am sure--but they were MUCH MUCH MUCH different than for youth actors and actresses b/c filming what you do isn't necessarily equated with "working" and having a "job". And what those kids did Sucked. But there is NO WAY they were only filming that show for so many hours at a time and taking long breaks and such. Absolutely no way. I know folks had their issues with that show--but on that show, those kids were without parents for several weeks.

You are referring to Kid Nation and those kids were NOT covered by any laws at all. They even made them sign waivers that they would not sue if they were injured! Just Google "Kid Nation Controversy" and you can see the firestorm raised by this "reality" show. I've directed you to one site in which the safety/exploitation of the kids is discussed.

http://tvblog.ugo.com/index.php/tvblog/more/kid_nation_controversy_widens/

ThreeFarmers said...

As a result of the Kid Nation fiasco, laws in the state it was filmed (New Mexico, I believe) were changed. It's up to each individual state to enact laws to protect children in the entertainment industry.

Lonnyswife said...

Here is a link to some of those letters from PA-ites who were not happy with the G's from the beginning. I just tried to get into the Patriot archives. Did they just start charging? I have been on so many websites lately looking up old info that I may have gotten my news sites confused.
The 'Trackback URL' listed on the included link page has been removed. Or at least on my computer I get some wierd message.


http://internetservices.readingeagle.com/blog/mother/archives/2005/05/here_we_go_agai.html

Anonymous said...

I really feel bad for Jon. I think he is really a nice guy underneath it all, but has become "trapped". Kate runs the show, what Kate wants, Kate gets... what is Jon to do? Divorce her? I feel he is unhappy, maybe would like a divorce, but with 8 kids they need each other for support and to raise the kids. I couldn't imagine how they would manage if they were divorced the kids living between two houses with only 1 parent at a time. Hopefully as the kids get older and more independent, he will be able to relax a little more. He does look exhausted, not like Kate exhausted, but fed up exhausted.

iluveeyore said...

Of course Jon looks exhausted. He is the only one in that house who ever behaves like a parent.

He's so lucky he has Kate to tell him what to do.

As for any hypothetical divorce... I think the kids would be the ones stuck with "parent support," since they are the only ones bringing in income.

By the way, does anyone else remember on one of the first Gosselin specials Jon and Kate sitting on their bed folding laundry? Jon distinctly states that they want the kids to have as NORMAL a life as possible.

What a joke that has become.

FIONA said...

I do not feel bad for Jon. I feel bad for Mady and Cara. I also feel bad for Aaden, Leah, Hannah, Joel, Colin and Alexis. They did n't ask for any of this. Jon is a grown man.

His happiness is his own responsibilty. And if he chooses to be henpecked, demeaned and belittled, so be it.

You write, "what is he supposed to do, divorce her?". Sometimes divorce IS the best option. No one is happy in that house. And honestly, if you take away all the help, do you really think that Kate will take care of her kids on her own???? She never has! Why would she suddenly give a damn?

In this situation, with the money they have earned, I can very easily see a judge agreeing to joint custody. What I don't see is Kate rearing her own kids.

In addition, all Jon would have to do is say "unstable", and mandatory evaluations would be done. End of Kate.

In my own opinion, without Kate, Jon could be a good Dad, and to a decent job at raising them.

mlou said...

I am not defending Jon but I can understand why he wouldn't go through a divorce. We are talking about child support for 8 kids not to mention possible alimony. Also, look at how Kate talks about Jon in front of the kids, can you imagine what she would say with him gone. These kids would be damaged even more than they are now. She has eliminated every other family member the kids have, I see her trying to do the same with Jon. I know legally he has rights, and I would hope he would get full custody, but it would be hell on earth either way. He may think it is better for him to stay with Kate because at least that way he can somewhat supervise what is going on.

Anonymous said...

"He does look exhausted, not like Kate exhausted, but fed up exhausted."

It has become very apparant to this viewer that the 'better' Kate looks, Jon appears more beat down and exhausted.

Katie said...

ThreeFarmers...
Your description of your grandmother is so heart-warming. She sounds like she was a very special person.

On a different note, I must admit that I was a J&K plus 8 fan....until I got on the internet to discuss the show. I had no idea what was really going on. I certainly knew that there were things very amiss about Kate, but I did not know the depth to it! Thanks for opening my eyes.

SmartyQ said...

IMO, Jon is just as bad as Katie anent treatment of the children. I looked closely at the picture of Jon with the boys (they're all dressed in black and white), and he's not cupping Joel's face with his hand, he's pinching it.

I also didn't like when he put his hand over Joel's mouth and nose in the pool. The hand-over-mouth was not the act of a loving father, and while Jon covered Joel's nose for a few seconds, it said a lot about his temper. Couldn't Jon see that Joel was terrified? I did.

Jon roughly grabs the kids and yanks on them. He's kicked at one of the plastic cars when the tup was in it, and he did so because he was angry.

He makes fun of Joel's lisp and apparently can't see how that little boy adores him. In fact, he called Joel's attachment to him 'abnormal.' In sum: Jon is junior high cruel.

sis said...

I found this old post regarding the Gosselins, but the link taking you to the actual article is not active. But there are 114 reponses to the blog post about it. I've read more on this blog in the past few days, but it has mysteriously disappeared, I swear, just this week.

http://readingeagle.com/blog.aspx?bid=8&id=1132&t
=Here-we-go-again

Sis

p.s. When posting links, I often only get 99% of the link. Could people please break up the link so that it fits on the comments page? Thanks so much.

Anonymous said...

Found this tidbit on the web. It's an article written before the make-over of their home about the home makeover.

http://archive.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/history/topic/179213-1.html

Anonymous said...

My opinion about Jon's job issues that he's had is that
1. Kate makes it way too hard for him to go to work and not feel guilty about not being at home. I'm sure that he gets more than enough phone calls from her during the day.
2. What kind of employer would hire this guy now. If you are in PA then I'm sure that you've heard of the Gs unless youve been under a rock or in a coma.

I think that Jon is just completely not hireable in PA. Not becuase he is dumb or doesnt know what he is doing, but because he alows himself to be included in the circus called Kate. Why would any employer welcome the circus into their office everyday?

In my opinion Jon seemed alot happier during the times that he was getting out of the house and going to work everyday. I'm sure that he missed the kids and that he'd rather be at work than have Kate up his ass about everything all day long.

MartaLou said...

Some young people have put together a parody of the Gosselins and posted it to YouTube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGf1WZmOhMk

IMO, they have managed to capture the true spirit of the Gosselin family. It would be funnier if it weren't for the fact that the Gosselin children are actually living with all this dysfunction.

beachluvin said...

Anonymous said...
Found this tidbit on the web. It's an article written before the make-over of their home about the home makeover.

http://archive.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/history/topic/179213-1.html

The following is a quote from the article, keep in mind the tups were still in the hospital when this article came out. I find it interesting how Jon says "this is the way it was "pitched" to me". Sounds like he is all too familiar with the "business" of pitching shows.

“It's a heart-to-heart show,” said Jonathan Gosselin, 27, explaining the telephone call he received from producers asking to feature his family on the syndicated show. “That's the way it was pitched to me.”

Anonymous said...

Thanks Beach, the article is great. Especially this part:

But the donations, which he called blessings, have not been without the occasional nasty remark.

“ ‘Why are you asking for these things?' ” Jonathan Gosselin said some people have asked.

“We didn't even solicit anyone,” he said. “The media came to us. I never said, ‘You owe me this.' That's where people get confused.”

Besides, he said, he and his wife plan to continue the chain of generosity.

“Everything that was donated to us, we will donate back to other multiples or other families in need,” he said.


I guess he meant "will be sold for profit at yard sales and a children's consignment shop in Lancaster county".

Anonymous said...

Wow, Beach--
I read that article from when the tips were born and the house was being remodeled.
It said that the church people donated a truck load of baby items.
Jon also stated that everything that they received from donations would be later donated to other families. According to the report, the church members of her father's church added a master bedroom and 2 bathrooms. Does anyone know how that house was laid out, before they moved to the Andrew Ave. home? I don't remember seeing their first house.

Anonymous said...

After reading the article on Home Delivery, I can't believe no one else has yet commented on the last, and probably most revealing quote from Jon in the article "Everything that was donated to us, we will donate back to other multiples or other families in need,” he said. To me, this just really reveals the hypocrasy of this whole situation. What's more, I was incredibly irked after watching the webisode on Youtube where J&K filmed themselves on dates and at Christmastime. It seemed like they were paving the way for their own TV show down the line, like they were putting the foundation in place for what they were planning all along. Anyone else feel the same way?

Anonymous said...

Has Jon ever been in sales?

B/c pitch also refers to a sales pitch and whether or not you are "buying" something with cash or are trying to be convinced of something...

You are being pitched to. It is a universal phrase that goes beyond television.

(not a defense of jon but rather an outsiders view from ALL angles. I could easily see that in searching evidence of a long term plan how that statement could be taken. I can also easily see how someone could use that phrase on a daily basis when they aren't busy negotiating a contract either.)

There is a fabulous website out there of a lie detection expert who is one of a handful of people deemed able to take lies.

I bet if you really wanted to take all this to the forefront, that you guys start e-mailing her (or him--but for some reason I think it is a her) and see what they can make of Jon and Kate's behavior.

The website is fascinating. But this person needs video footage that shows the people talking and making statements so that she can hear voice tone and watch body languge. Unfortunately documented interviews that were not videotaped won't be enough.

But I challenge those here who really think Jon and KAte is lying--that would be your golden ticket of proof.

She has a link on the side that says she welcomes opportunities to test her skills.

http://www.eyesforlies.blogspot.com/2008/07/cindy-anthony-clarification.html

4girlsoneboy said...

"Jonathan said he and his family, which includes 3-year-old twin daughters, Madelyn and Cara, will continue to reside in Hershey until the babies are all able to come home in late July."


Wow, this is the first time I heard of this quoted from the link about the Home Delivery show. Do you think this means that not only the twins were with Kate's mom, but also Jon and Kate, while the babies were in the NICU at Hershey Medical Center. That woman would have to be a saint to put up with them for a few months. And to think that Kate said "they didn't know how to help".

Lonnyswife said...

Anon 05:47-"It said that the church people donated a truck load of baby items.
Jon also stated that everything that they received from donations would be later donated to other families."
I noticed this quote as well and after giving it alittle thought I wonder if he meant all the donated items that weren't matchy-matchy. Or was that stuff yard saled as well.
Hypocrite thy name is Gosselin

Lonnyswife said...

Being fairly new to this blog I am not sure the best place to post this so if it needs to be moved by moderators, please move it.
As I stated I am fairly new here
(long story as to why I have an inordinate amount of free time on my hands..) and hadn't seen any discussion on my question, which is this:
Is there a reason that out of the 493+ thousand visitors to this site (and true I probably haven't read every single letter from the ones who have posted)there isn't a single soul with itimate first hand knowledge of the Gs who has come to their defense? I understand that the Gs have burned many many (all?) bridges but even so, you would think there would be one person out there who would say,"Listen, I see these people everyday and you GWOP-ers just don't get it".
I have been reading many other blogs about the G's, letters to editors, magazine article comments,etc. and it appears that the only people coming to the Gs defense are people who:
1. Are rabid fans of the show who get rather hyped up at the mention of exploitation of the children
2. Know nothing more than what they see on the television every week.
3. Have some goofy idea that a good marriage consists of hitting, belittling, and correcting your spouse's grammer in front of others. (Insert snarky comment here: Obviously all Jerry Springer fams!)
4. The G's themselves, who can only come up with the reason for our "hating" them (my mistake, I thought we were "concerned" for their children) is we are jealous.
I was in debate club for awhile in HS and if this was a team's only rebuttal they would have lost big time.
Have I missed something? Has anyone seen real -inside information on what is really going on? I think I do know better than to take everything I read or hear at face value if I don't personally witness the event but I find it ludicrous that Jon says he and Kate are the only ones with any sort of believable (cough-cough) knowledge regarding their family. Everyone (I wanted to capitalize but know you guys don't like that)
else, from the media in all forms, on down to ex-friends or volunteers are not to be believed, according to Jon. Excuse me?
There are so many things wrong with these parents one can only hope that the children won't all learn by example. But alas, I think we are already privy to this not being the case.
At this point I can only hope that with that many children, the odds increase that perhaps one out of 8 will not grow up to be a hitting, whining, screaming, grammatically challenged, un-employed, lying, controlling, joyless, friendless, egotistical adult who's sense of entitlement is so large that they need to constantly move to larger and larger homes just to contain it.

Anonymous said...

Jon is a blue collar guy who is taking care of his family as best he can. No, he is not a Doctor or a college graduate - just a plain vanilla working guy. It is however, Jon and Kate working together with the kids and not just the Doctor working.
Kate is a pain and her nasty ways will ultimately bring the show to an end but Jon is a nice guy.

ThreeFarmers said...

lonnyswife,

I read your post with great interest and fully agree with what you said. I couldn't think of a single thing to add to it. In fact, I kept waiting for some J&K supporters, friends, family to address your post. Never happened.

FIONA said...

“We didn't even solicit anyone,” he said. “The media came to us. I never said, ‘You owe me this.' That's where people get confused.”
----
Jon is just not quite bright enough to keep his stories straight. Kate did say that society was responsible to help raise the babies when begging for a free nurse for another year.

I have come to think that either the state of PA is overly liberal in its use of tax dollars or terribly dumb.

Anonymous said...

"Is there a reason that out of the 493+ thousand visitors to this site (and true I probably haven't read every single letter from the ones who have posted)there isn't a single soul with itimate first hand knowledge of the Gs who has come to their defense? "

The quick answer is that not all comments are posted. They are published at the discretion of the Serena and the moderators. I wouldn't be surprised if there were friends of Kate or Jon who tried to defend them, but used foul or threatening language in their anger and, therefore, did not have their comments published. It's also possible that for their own sanity they have decided to ignore us all together.

Anonymous said...

"Jon is a blue collar guy who is taking care of his family as best he can. "

Jon MAY think he is taking care of his family the best he can and IMO, that topic is subject to and of much debate. However, Jon is NOT a 'blue collar guy'. Describing him to be in the same category of the blue collar working class, men and women alike, in an insult to ALL the blue collar working class!

Evileye said...

Actually in reality Jon is not a blue collar guy. His father was a prominent dentist, so Jon was spoiled. He probably was expected to finish college (which his dad would have paid for) but he was being lazy taking his time, all wrapped up in Kate. I think that if Jon & Kate never got married he would have graduated school and have some sort of career. I think Jon lacks ambition because he was spoiled and he never had to work (unlike Kate) for his material things.

Hugabug said...

I also searched for some articles. Didn't find any in the PA papers, but found this with the New York Times

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C04E2D7163AF934A25753C1A9629C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=2.

''It's an institutional existence,'' said Kate Gosselin, of Wyomissing, Pa., who has about 50 volunteers helping with her 5-month-old sextuplets and her 3-year-old twins. ''One of our bathrooms is like a public restroom because so many people are in and out of it. There are notes and signs Scotch-taped everywhere. That's just not normal.''

Then they will have the risks any new parent takes. After the Gosselins had their sextuplets, Mrs. Gosselin lost her job as a nurse and Jonathan Gosselin, a network engineer, lost his. Though companies donated everything from diapers to home improvements, the Hayeses still have mortgage payments to make.

''We're scraping the bottom of the barrel,'' Mr. Gosselin said.

IMO I think that the Hayeses still have to pay a mortgage is a typo, and should have been Gosselins.

Note that the writer was under the impression that both Kate and Jon lost their jobs. That's their MO. They don't come out and ask for help, all they have to do is describe how they are struggling (we can't pay our mortgage because Jon lost his job when he asked for insurance)and people open their hearts and their wallets. Very exploitative of human kindness.

The article is not about the Gosselins, it is about the Hayes.

What really struck me though was how different the tone of Mr. Hayes was compared to Jon's. The tone was more encompassing, while Jon's was all about how much how much they were struggling.

I also found this link to the van:

http://internetservices.readingeagle.com/blog/mother/archives/2005/08/prayers_answere.html

I thought that the van was donated? Did they purchase it or is this damage control?

iluveeyore said...

I just want to point out that the "added bedroom" to the Gosselin's first house was the transformation of the garage into a master bedroom. Then the original master bedroom was used for the sextuplets.

No footage was added... it was just re-arranged.

iluveeyore said...

The article in The New York Times WAS about the Hayes family in New Jersey. It is confusing because the date on the top of the page is 2008, but the date on the article is 2004.

The Hayes sextuplets were born in October 2004 -- and the parents already had TWO sets of twins... but went right along with IUI to get "just one more."

I guess Mrs. Hayes did not photoshop her kids' pictures around the tv media. We could have been watching the Hayes 12.

Anonymous said...

"Is there a reason that out of the 493+ thousand visitors to this site (and true I probably haven't read every single letter from the ones who have posted)there isn't a single soul with itimate first hand knowledge of the Gs who has come to their defense? "

IMO, if and when the G's do move from the state of PA, we will see quite the opposite and there will be an increase in individuals speaking out NEGATIVELY of J & K and are currently remaining quiet or 'keeping the peace' if you will.

Moons in Leo said...

"Is there a reason that out of the 493+ thousand visitors to this site (and true I probably haven't read every single letter from the ones who have posted)there isn't a single soul with itimate first hand knowledge of the Gs who has come to their defense? "

IMO, if and when the G's do move from the state of PA, we will see quite the opposite and there will be an increase in individuals speaking out NEGATIVELY of J & K and are currently remaining quiet or 'keeping the peace' if you will.

8/23/2008 11:48 AM

I totally agree.
It is amazing that of all the people they have come in contact
with, no one defends their behavior. Perhaps because it is indefensible.

Anonymous said...

lonnyswife makes a great point. I've been lurking around everywhere trying to find a family member, friend (other than Beth's letter, and that one's as old as the hills),church members, neighbors, anyone that will step up and say that "Truth Breeds Hatred" and some of the other sites, including this one, are all lies and they have proof. Someone other than J&K themselves, naturally. Other than fans who don't personally know them or even live in the same state, no one, not even Kate's mother or father, cousins, NO ONE will start their own site and defend them. As a mom myself, and a daughter, cousin, friend- I just don't see how they could just sit by and not defend them if these are untruths. They wouldn't have to hop on these blogs, they could start their own page! But we get crickets.

Anonymous said...

If i recall correctly, sometime back on the FORT message board, there wre notes from a parent of a classmate of the twins. She had hosted the twins at a birthday party for her child and was very complimentary about their behavior. She also stated that she only saw Jon at the twins' school and found him to be lovely. IIRC, she stated that she never saw Kate at the school for any activities and had never met her.

Also IIRC, someone purporting to be Jon's brother posted on that board. He was most definately NOT complimentary about Kate and what had become of Jon.

Anonymous said...

I found this article through my school's library newspaper websearch service. The citation is MOM OF SEXTUPLETS PROCLAIMS SHE'S READY TO RAISE LARGE FAMILY
Belleville News-Democrat, The (IL) - May 16, 2004

This article says that "Kate Gosselin said she would like to remain at home for at least two years to care for the babies. Jonathan Gosselin is an information technology director for a petroleum equipment company near Reading. "

I thought I'd post it because I'd never heard about the petroleum equipment company before.

Anonymous said...

Sorry to do this, but I'm posting as I find. I posted about the petroleum company. Another article says "Kate Gosselin is a labor and delivery nurse at The Reading Hospital. Her husband is an information technology specialist, Microsoft certified."

Serena said...

The quick answer is that not all comments are posted. They are published at the discretion of the Serena and the moderators. I wouldn't be surprised if there were friends of Kate or Jon who tried to defend them, but used foul or threatening language in their anger and, therefore, did not have their comments published.

I can assure you that out of the many thousands of comments submitted to this blog in the past few months, not a single comment has been from a purported relative, friend, or neighbor offering a vehement defense of Jon and Kate. Not ONE.

Of course, if that were to happen now that I have said that, we would verify that person's identity as we did Julie's.

But I'm sure anyone who would have reason to want to defend Jon and/or Kate based upon knowing them personally would prefer to do it on their own terms rather than relying on an obscure little comment buried on someone else's blog.

Anonymous said...

To Jon & Kate:
STOP THE INSANITY

ThreeFarmers said...

I'm not sure what you mean by "data", are you talking statistics, or just empirical information?

There have been people to come forward besides Jodie and Julie. BK has had her personal run-ins with the Gosselins and has posted as such.

I think J&K have themselves in a pretty tightly-knit cocoon right now. They are surrounded mostly by people who are riding the same gravy train that they are. The people around them are getting paid by them and I'm sure have confidentiality agreements.

I don't think it's particularly easy to speak up against the Gosselins as we have seen the threatening and profanity laced messages that come firing back from their camp.

Personally, I think the Gosselins situation is going to get a whole lot worse. I'm sure the NI (a publication that is desperately trying to gain some credibility...see the John Edwards story) will being doing a follow up on this and other media outlets will be paying attention. I also agree with whomever mentioned that once they move out of state, there will be plenty of coverage from news organizations in PA.

Anonymous said...

Wilma said...
By "data" I meant comments like
"I live down the street and when my kids go knock on the door and ask the twins to play, no on answers but we know they are home"
or
"we live in one of the houses that share a backyard and the tups run inside whenever a game of neigborhood tag starts"
or even
"I used to date a caterer and they drop off x amount of food each week"
Not everyone would have confidentiality agreements. I just don't see comments like these posted anywhere.
_______________________________
If you were a neighbor. resident of their subdivision, or the girlfriend of their caterer and posted something along the lines of what you are referencing, you can bet that KON will harass, harangue, attempt to intimidate you into silence and submission. Look at the nastiness BK (and by association, BK's child) and Julie (Aunt Jodi's sister) have gone through. This is why the "data" you refer to is not here. People are not comfortable giving that level of detail about who they are. Note the number of posters here who are "anonymous." Interesting. I bet many of these are exactly the people you are referring to.

ThreeFarmers said...

You're right. Not everyone would have confidentiality agreements, but you can bet that anyone delivering regularly to their home would. They have posted a sign in their yard to make sure the neighbors are forewarned.

Here's a link with a photo of the sign and the words of a neighbor who speaks about what it's like living in the same subdivision as the Gosselins. You have scroll down a short way to find it.

*CLICK*


People are speaking up and they are brave to do so because we have seen the hateful messages that have been sent from the Gosselin camp to those who do.

Also, really, if I had the train wreck living across the street from my house, I doubt I'd waste time looking information on the internet when I get to witness it all first hand. I'm sure there are plenty of people who are done with the Gosselins and just want them gone.

Anonymous said...

Who is BK? and her child? Do you mean Beth Carson?

As for why people aren't speaking out, I think it has to do with confidential papers that they ask EVERYONE to sign.

ThreeFarmers said...

BK says that she is not Beth. I only know that she is a cancer survivor and has a child in school.. I believe the same school as Cara and Mady, but I'm not sure.

Wilma said...

Anonymous said...

Who is BK? and her child? Do you mean Beth Carson?

As for why people aren't speaking out, I think it has to do with confidential papers that they ask EVERYONE to sign.
8/24/2008 7:36 PM



So has anyone ever seen someone post that they were asked to sign a confidentiality agreement and decided against it.

I guess I just am questioning how two dingbats got so powerful people are scared of them.

ThreeFarmers said...

If they have signed a confidentiality agreement, then they CAN'T post that they've signed a confidentiality agreement.

ThreeFarmers said...

I'm sorry. I misread your previous post. No, I have never seen anyone post that they refused to sign a confidentiality agreement. I don't know why they don't post. Not everyone is following this issue as closely on the internet as we are.

Can you imagine... the whole world doesn't revolve around Jon & Kate Plus 8?

K.C. said...

Anonymous said...
lonnyswife makes a great point. I've been lurking around everywhere trying to find a family member, friend (other than Beth's letter, and that one's as old as the hills)...

It was confirmed elsewhere on GWoP, around a month ago IIRC, that the letter you mentioned was NOT really written by Beth. I think it was in a comment from thetruthwillsetyoufree/Julie

Regarding neighbors speaking out...I have read comments from two different neighbors on other blogs. They were both negative. I have not seen any kind words written about this family either.
___________________________________

ThreeFarmers said...
If they have signed a confidentiality agreement, then they CAN'T post that they've signed a confidentiality agreement.

I have signed a few confidentiality agreements before and that was not the case. You are allowed to tell anyone you choose that you signed the paper. You just can't disclose the details of the agreement.

Sharla said...

LB, thank you. I was just pondering.

Anonymous said...

Kate should be equally ashamed of her constant complaining "eight children are sooooo much work"....."I am soooooo tired"......."I am soooo behind in my work right now"......"When you have 8 children, it is soooo difficult". Kate used fertility treatments, so why the complaining? What did she think she was going to get? Puppies?

Ever heard of the Duggar family of Arkansas? They're expecting baby #18 and yet you never hear Mrs. Duggar complain. True, they have their own unique lifestyle, but still, her love for her children is evident. She consistently says that children are a gift.

The Duggars are Christians also, J&K, just like you purport to be, only their beliefs are real, not rehearsed for the camera like that farce of a family dinner prayer shown during the July 4th episode at the beach house.

J.S. said...

AT LAST1 We have found the BEST place for you to donate all of the clothing and baby equipment that was given to you.
You can send your donations to the family in Egypt who have septuplets.
Also, they need a bigger home.
Perhaps you can regularly send them cash.
A perfect place to pass on your blessings!

Mollybloom said...

Hello, we do not donate, when we can profit. After all, who is more deserving than Jon and Kate? Are there other families who have needs? Too bad. When you are as famous, important, and as wonderful as we are, you just can't be bothered. Please, no more talk about other people, people!

Treegazer said...

I understadn what you are saying regarding your own life situation. Sounds like you have worked hard in your life for your family and that is wonderful.

I do not think it is necessary to slam another family for the gifts and experiences they can get in their own life. I wouldn't wish to take any thing to be taken away from you or your family.

While it appears many people find plently to judge the Gosselins upon, I am happy to offer both their family and you (and everyone else on this planet) wishes for an abundant and joyous life.

Peace~Carrie

Anonymous said...

I think who ever wrote this should be ashamed of themselves for writing something like this. Jon does what is best for his family and that is to provide family needs. A t.v show is a good way for them to get money. Jon could work all day everyday & get money, but he wants to be a good father & spend time with his children. They have 8 kids to put through college & pretty much all at the same time, that is a lot of money! They have earned a vacation too! I can't believe you would write something like this, you don't know everything about them.

Anonymous said...

My son worked for college and got scholarships, we could never afford college savings as we didn't have much money when he was small. So, that being said, do what 90% of Americans who go to college does... work, scholarship and loans. It works.
PS.. He graduated with a Political Science Degree 1.5 years ago, got a great job, owns his own home and has a paid off car. Yes we are proud and he accomplished this before he was 22. HE WORKED for this not us.